[AT] Need some help, hard starting CR950 Briggs
Cecil Bearden
crbearden at copper.net
Tue Feb 15 10:22:30 PST 2022
Stuart:
Don't give up the Day job!!!!!!!!!!!
Cecil
On 2/15/2022 10:24 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> So what you are saying is that you are stuck with ether or...?
>
> Sorry, couldn't resist. :)
>
> On 2/15/22 10:14, Cecil Bearden wrote:
>>
>> There are 2 types of ether starting fluid. 20% and 50%
>>
>> Cecil
>>
>> On 2/15/2022 8:19 AM, Indiana Robinson wrote:
>>> Thanks guys...I need to use it this week and maybe next week. I'll
>>> be trying some things, especially Steve's LP trick. I wonder where I
>>> put those torches. :-)
>>> One thing on my side now is that it will be 50 degrees today and 60
>>> tomorrow. I may not need anything extra. I do know that one problem
>>> is the thick oil in the tank and it not having a way to clutch out
>>> the pump for starting.
>>> I'll try to keep you posted.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Feb 14, 2022 at 9:59 AM Stuart Harner
>>> <stuart at harnerfarm.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Remember the old fire triangle? Fuel-Air-Heat.
>>>
>>> With the ever more restrictive regulations filtering down to the
>>> smaller engines the manufacturers have had to lean out the mix
>>> as far as possible. If you were to put a pyrometer on one my
>>> guess is that at operating temperature they are running on the
>>> lean side of peak.
>>>
>>> As air temp drops it gets more dense but without a choke to
>>> compensate the mix is just too lean to light off. To make things
>>> worse they have taken all of the adjustments away from the end
>>> user to prevent us from becoming criminals against the
>>> regulations. I suspect it also makes the carbs easier and
>>> cheaper to manufacture. If a bad one slips through, just replace
>>> it or the engine because it is cheaper than figuring out the
>>> problem. We see this in a lot more then carburetors.
>>>
>>> Changing to a lighter hydraulic fluid will help make it easier
>>> to spin the engine faster when pulling the starter. I am not
>>> sure if that will help make a hotter spark or not considering it
>>> probably has electronic ignition anyway. Faster starting RPM
>>> could help with sucking in more fuel each stroke but then that
>>> means more air to, so back to lean.
>>>
>>> I suspect that Farmer's engine sputters once in a while is that
>>> the raw fuel builds up enough in the cylinder to cause a rich
>>> enough mixture to fire once or twice. Once that is burned off,
>>> back to square one.
>>>
>>> I am not sure that adjusting the valves would help any unless
>>> there is a way to lengthen the duration. Taking out all the
>>> backlash might cause the valve to open a fraction sooner, but
>>> once everything is warm and expanded there is a risk of it not
>>> closing fully and burning the valve or seat.
>>>
>>> To get a more rich mixture for starting you could try to
>>> restrict air (like the old choke plates did) or add fuel like a
>>> primer does.
>>>
>>> I have a Knipco stye heater that will not light off at any air
>>> temp unless I use both hands and cover as much of the air intake
>>> as possible. It lights in less than a second and then runs fine.
>>> I have tried different nozzles and moving the igniter around,
>>> but it still needs less air to get going.
>>>
>>> On the 1978 motorcycle I once had it was a victim of early
>>> tampering with emissions on motorcycles. When new it would not
>>> start on a cool day and it had a manual choke. I rigged up a way
>>> to inject a little ether into the airbox that was buried under
>>> the seat. Had to put 10,000 miles on that bike before it got
>>> over that problem.
>>>
>>> The idea of using an unlit torch to add a little fuel sounds
>>> like a good one. Red Green would just slap a little piece of
>>> duct tape on the air intake until it warms up.
>>>
>>> Best of luck to Farmer getting this working.
>>>
>>> Stuart
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2/14/22 01:34, Greg Hass wrote:
>>>> I have a JD Zero Turn with 27 hp. Briggs engine and electric
>>>> start. Anything around 45 to 50 degrees and it just wouldn't
>>>> start. It does not idle good either, but the book says that is
>>>> because of emissions control. My brother has a Simplicity zero
>>>> turn 3 years old and several times has tried to start it in 40
>>>> degree and it just won't fire so it is not just my mower. Both
>>>> engines have fixed jets so no adjustment is possible. It is
>>>> possible other things could be wrong, but my only other idea is
>>>> to make sure it has fresh WINTER blend gas.
>>>> Greg Hass
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Feb 13, 2022 at 8:15 AM Moe Fretz
>>>> <tubetester at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Try this site, they should be able to help you.
>>>>
>>>> http://ppeten.com/forums/search.php?search_id=newposts
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 18:51 Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Farmer,
>>>> Just a thought, my log splitter was hard to start in
>>>> cold weather, until I changed the hydraulic fluid from
>>>> the OEM fluid to transmission fluid,a whole world of
>>>> difference.
>>>>
>>>> Mike M
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 2/12/2022 9:24 PM, Stephen Offiler wrote:
>>>>> Hi farmer: I'd have to think you've already been down
>>>>> this road, but, I'll say for the record that I've had
>>>>> pretty decent luck downloading manuals from the Briggs
>>>>> site. But I haven't done it lately, and it's always
>>>>> 20-year old stuff when I do. The other thing I'll
>>>>> mention is the good old unlit propane torch in the
>>>>> intake trick. That's my go-to when they're almost
>>>>> trying to start. There's spark and fuel but the modern
>>>>> carburetors are set lean for emissions and it just
>>>>> seems that the choke doesn't quite get the mixture
>>>>> rich enough.
>>>>>
>>>>> Good luck,
>>>>> Steve O.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 7:43 PM Indiana Robinson
>>>>> <robinson46176 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> We have a log splitter a couple of years old that
>>>>> has a OHV CR950 Briggs. It only has a few hours on
>>>>> it but has become quite hard to start (recoil
>>>>> start). It is way too recent for my knowledge
>>>>> base... It seems that most things are these days.
>>>>> Apparently the OHV Brigg's have a cam bump
>>>>> "compression relief" I also understand that there
>>>>> is an important valve adjustment procedure that
>>>>> can normally improve starting problems. We can't
>>>>> find a site that gives a clear and understandable
>>>>> explanation of the procedure.
>>>>> Does anyone know of a site with a clear
>>>>> description of how to do it? It will usually start
>>>>> if it is sitting in the sun and the temp is at
>>>>> least 50... Yesterday at 45 degrees it "ALMOST"
>>>>> started 837 times... It keeps firing enough to
>>>>> keep you trying and trying...
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> Francis Robinson
>>>>> aka "farmer"
>>>>> Central Indiana USA
>>>>> robinson46176 at gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>> --
>>>> Moe Fretz
>>>>
>>>> L’Orignal ON,
>>>> Canada
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> --
>>>
>>> Francis Robinson
>>> aka "farmer"
>>> Central Indiana USA
>>> robinson46176 at gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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