[AT] Diesel rated oil/ Gasoline powered engine?
Grant Brians
sales at heirloom-organic.com
Wed May 29 15:48:31 PDT 2019
Carl, I have run 15W40 oil in all of our older gasoline tractors and
trucks for decades now. I use that in the Farmall 140 as well as the
Olivers, AC, Cat, Massey-Harris, etc. Also, when the gasoline vehicles
were rated for 10W/xx once many miles were in place, the same thing.
Why? Because it works better than the modern 10W and single viscosity
oils. Too clean makes no sense to me in terms of the surfaces based on
the oil characteristics. Currently I am not using my Studebakers, but
the only problem I found with modern multi-viscosity oils (and yes I
moved to 15W40 on them and the other old vehicles) was if the engine had
no oil filter and had NOT been rebuilt, then too much gunk could be
released when they moved to a modern oil if they had sat for years.....
Grant Brians - Hollister,California farmer
On 5/28/2019 3:40 PM, Carl Gogol wrote:
>
> Thanks for all the input Steve, Mark, Jim, Mike, Cecil, Alan,, Henry,
> Dave and Spencer. You might guess from my question that I was a bit
> reluctant to just run the tractor with Diesel rated oil. So, although
> I am cheap by training as a product designer, I will bite the bullet
> and change the oil. I had ran the engine long enough to fill the new
> filter and check the oil pressure which was great, about 30 PSI, but
> wondered about longer term use. I also learned a lot about oils from
> your comments. I found it to be especially interesting / troubling
> that the Diesel oil could leave the cylinder surfaces too clean.
>
> BTW, does anyone know the recommended oil for an International 140? I
> am guessing straight 20 or 30 for summer or perhaps 10W30 for year
> around. Comments and opinions here might be interesting.
>
> Carl
>
> *From:* AT <at-bounces at lists.antique- tractor.com> *On Behalf Of
> *Stephen Offiler
> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 28, 2019 9:39 AM
> *To:* Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group
> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [AT] Diesel rated oi/ Gasoline powered engine?
>
> Interesting article:
>
> https://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/28576/comparing-gasoline-diesel-engine-oils-
>
> So diesel oils still contain ZDDP, which was reduced or removed from
> spark-ignition oils after around SF or SG (I think) due to catalytic
> converter poisoning. ZDDP is desirable to have in an oil, absent the
> concern over the catalytic converter.
>
> The choices in diesel oils tend to be higher in viscosity; we can all
> see that on the shelves at the store. This can be bad news in a
> modern, fresh, tight-bearing-clearance engine. Thinner oils are
> necessary to properly fill the smaller bearing clearances. On the
> contrary, it seems that the looser old iron we should be discussing
> here would benefit from the thicker viscosity in most cases. Up to
> the point where there is concern about pumpability when very cold.
>
> That last concern, where diesel oils have higher detergent, doing an
> excessively good job on the cylinder walls - I'm struggling to
> understand why this is a factor for gas engines and not a factor for
> diesel engines.
>
> SO
>
> On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 8:38 AM Mark Johnson
> <markjohnson100 at centurylink.net
> <mailto:markjohnson100 at centurylink.net>> wrote:
>
> I don't know how much the formula might have changed, but from the
> early 1970's through when my dad left the farm in the mid 2000's,
> we ran Rotella T 15W-40 in a JD 620, 2 730's, an IH 300, AC 190XT,
> 210, and 8030, several pickup trucks and Gleaner combines, and
> heaven-only-knows how many cars, including mine (Chevy 350 V8).
> Never had a lubrication-related failure that I can remember. We
> bought the stuff by the barrel; usually had two of them around -
> one at each farm, 14 miles apart. The only reason I no longer use
> it is that today's cars recommend 5W-20 or 5W-30 viscosity.
>
> The only exceptions were the JD H and A, where we used "Golden
> Shell" non-detergent SAE 20 or 30, depending on time of year.
>
> Disclaimer: My dad's baby sister was married to a Shell jobber,
> but we paid the same price as everybody else :-).
>
> Mark J
> Columbia, MO
> Southern Indiana farm boy now working at the big university :-)
>
> On 5/26/2019 12:04 PM, David Steinich wrote:
>
> I've started using the Rotella T-4 15W-40 in all my tractors
> that I don't expect to work in the winter. Haven't been doing
> it long enough to see if there are any damaging effects
> though. I have read about the additives like Henry mentioned -
> specifically zinc and how it is bad for catalytic converters,
> but good for our old valve lifters.
>
> It's also a lot easier to just have two oils on the shelf.
>
> Dave
>
> On Sun, May 26, 2019 at 11:50 AM Carl Gogol
> <cgogol1971 at gmail.com <mailto:cgogol1971 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Henry-
> Unfortunately, the oil I used is not rated S anything.
> How does that change
> your answer?
> Carl
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: AT <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
> <mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com>> On Behalf
> Of Henry Miller
> Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2019 9:52 AM
> To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
> <mailto:at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> Subject: Re: [AT] Diesel rated oi/ Gasoline powered engine?
>
> Read closely, most diesel rated oils are rated up to sf or
> something like
> that. The s stands for spark ignition, and the f is the
> revision. If it has
> a s rating at all it is better for your engine than a more
> modern sj rating.
> Because of emissions Car engine manufacturers have been
> unable to get the
> older additives needed by your tractor to work and have
> had to change their
> bearings to get an oil that lubricates without destroying
> emissions. Diesel
> engines have different considerations and still have those
> additives.
>
> Bottom line, in all antique gas engines I start in the
> diesel oil section
> and then find one with a gas rating.
>
> --
> Henry Miller
> hank at millerfarm.com <mailto:hank at millerfarm.com>
>
> On Sun, May 26, 2019, at 8:39 AM, Carl Gogol wrote:
> > Without thinking, I just drained my "new" 1968 IH-140
> and filled it
> > with Rotella 15W-40 T4 Diesel rated oil.
> > It is one of those "All Fleet" oils and I was easily led
> astray by
> > that slogan. Of course I carefully read the label once
> the jug was empty.
> > What would you do? Drain and replace or leave it in and
> replace it
> > next year? Are the additives all that different?
> > The IH 140 is an old state road clipper with a side
> mount "HydroClipper"
> > sickle bar mower. The engine sounds really tight and
> absent of any
> > sounds common from a long used engine. It will probably
> get less than
> > 20 hours use in a year.
> > Carl in rainy Mallkus NY
> >
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