[AT] Was Old tractor question; now collection dynamics.

Mark Johnson markjohnson100 at centurylink.net
Fri Feb 15 08:14:06 PST 2019


Lots of wheelspin, just barely enough torque to pull it off...and at the 
time, the H was 30+ years old and hadn't yet had an engine overhaul. 
That came several years later.

Our farms in southern Indiana were (and still are) a collection of 
mudholes and creeks surrounded by fields. Of the 2 farms/600 acres I 
grew up working, all but about 120 are now planted in trees. I doubt I 
will see any revenue from the forestry project, but I think my son and 
his second cousins probably will.

We had a 300-foot, 3/4 inch steel cable, donated by a neighbor who ran 
the local stone quarry. There were times when we needed every inch of it 
to reach high ground. Carrying 30-40 feet of chain on tractor platforms 
during harvest was routine.

Mark J

On 2/15/2019 10:01 AM, Dean Vinson wrote:
>
> Mark Johnson, great anecdotes.   Pulling that stuck 730 and corn wagon 
> out with the H must have been a heck of project!
>
> Dean Vinson
>
> Saint Paris, OH
>
> *From:*AT [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] *On Behalf Of 
> *Mark Johnson
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 14, 2019 8:31 AM
> *To:* at at lists.antique-tractor.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AT] Was Old tractor question; now collection dynamics.
>
> Here are a few memories...
>
> Although I now live in the city, I have a 1940 JD H (narrow front!) in 
> my shed, awaiting when I have time to get it running and restored. 
> Little Johnny was purchased by my grandfather, brand new, in 1941. 
> Until he came into my hands, he was a 'working' tractor that always 
> had a job to perform. In my younger days I used it to:
>
> - Pull wagonloads of corn from the field to the grain bins, then 
> unhitch from the wagon, and hook the PTO to the elevator to unload. 
> The real fun was getting a load of corn around a sharp corner while 
> going up a 30 degree slope, with a railroad crossing at the top. Take 
> a good run at it in low gear, and don't try it if there was a train in 
> sight...which could be fairly frequently, in the mid 1970's the 
> now-abandoned Monon sometimes had 12 trains a day.
>
> - Rake hay. When I was 12 or so, we had the clutch set up so tight 
> that I couldn't yank it out on one occasion; I remember my dad having 
> to run up behind me, jump on the hitch, and pull the clutch out so I 
> could stop.
>
> - On one memorable occasion, all 12 HP were put to use to pull one of 
> our 730's plus 110 bushels of corn out of a mud hole. Kind of like the 
> tail wagging the dog, but we got it done!
>
> Little Johnny has a dent in the hood, underneath the steering shaft, 
> that I will not be fixing...here's the story: Sometime in the middle 
> 1940's my dad and his brother cut down a tree, which fell the wrong 
> way and landed on top of the tractor, 'twanging' the steering shaft 
> and flexing it far enough to put a nice little crease in the sheet 
> metal. The shaft didn't bend or break, and when my dad and granddad 
> repainted the tractor in the late 1970's they didn't fix the dent - so 
> I won't either. My dad is now gone, and his brother is approaching 90 
> years old and in poor health, but that dent is a family memory...
>
> Other tractors we had back then:
>
> - JD A with high-altitude piston kit; compression was high enough it 
> wouldn't start when cold without opening the cylinder cocks. The 
> hot-rod kit to increase starter torque was a flop. That year of A was 
> rated at 38 HP, ours pulled 43 on a PTO dynamometer  with nothing more 
> than new plugs.
>
> - JD 620, essentially stock. Not sure what has happened to it; I have 
> a connecting rod from its last overhaul stashed in my garage. A truly 
> beefy piece.
>
> - Two Diesel 730's, one with fenders and one without. I think they 
> were built in two different years, the gearing was slightly 
> different...the no-fenders tractor had a 5th gear that clipped along 
> at about 7 mph at rated speed...great for driving in for lunch. Both 
> of them could plow all day on one tank of fuel. My cousin has one of 
> them, the other was sold. I can't remember if both came from one 
> tractor, or one from each, but we had two cracked flywheels at 100 lbs 
> each, sitting around the farm for many years...my cousin and I 
> threatened to build a heavy-weight cart out of them, using the 
> equally-beefy drive axle that was the last remaining part of 
> great-great-uncle Jim's 1903 Cadillac. I think all those pieces got 
> bulldozed into a hole after the arsonist burned down the barn on my 
> grandfather's place.
>
> - The one oddball in the fleet, my maternal grandfather's Farmall 300. 
> We mostly used it to mow hay, left the 9W mower hooked up most of the 
> summer. Also used it to carry a platform with fence building/repair 
> supplies into places where a pickup couldn't go. Never a great 
> tractor, but it always would start in the winter, and often pulled or 
> belt-started one of the 730's. This was the tractor that suffered the 
> short in the starter solenoid on me while I was a half-mile from the 
> house, clipping pasture. As far as I know, the engine has never been 
> torn down.
>
> - An AC 190XT - never a great tractor, engine had to be re-sleeved 
> after it developed antifreeze leaks.
>
> - An AC 210 - no cab, tremendous pulling power - would pull 6 16" 
> bottoms with ease. Big drawback...not enough radiator. If you ran it 
> at full rated RPM in heavy Indiana clay soil, it would overheat within 
> a couple hundred yards. I tried for 2 years to talk Pop into spending 
> $1000 or so to have a special radiator built for it with an extra row 
> of tubes, so it would cool. An oddity: we got it when it was about 5-6 
> years old, but we were the first legitimate owner. It had been stolen 
> from a dealer lot when new, then somebody else stole it from that guy. 
> It got back into 'circulation' when a sheriff's deputy caught the 
> second thief and his brother trying to pull-start it on a cold 
> morning. They didn't seem to know what they were doing, so the officer 
> called the serial number in...and sure enough, it came back as stolen. 
> It sat on a lot for 3 years or so while the insurance company, 
> original dealer, and AC fought over the details. We got it for a very 
> reasonable price, with only about 250 hours on the tach. Hadn't been 
> abused, the guys who stole it never even pulled the seal wires off the 
> fuel injection pump to attempt to boost output (with the 
> aforementioned radiator, it wouldn't have helped much anyway).
>
> - An AC 8030 - full airconditioned cab, 10-15 more HP than the 210 
> (same engine block, more blower). Had enough radiator to run at full 
> power with that 6 bottom plow...and almost was enough to get me to 
> come back to the farm when I was about 35 or so. Still on the farm, 
> used by a neighbor who rents the tillable acreage. A/C compressor no 
> longer holds refrigerant, so it is not pleasant to drive in high 
> summer any more! Price of a new compressor was/is outrageous. [Tractor 
> aircon has always been problematic...designers don't realize what a 
> hostile mechanical environment a farm tractor can be; seals and 
> fittings that work fine in automotive use just don't stand up in the 
> field.]
>
> Good times in southern Indiana...
>
> Mark J
> Columbia MO
>
> On 2/14/2019 5:56 AM, Henry Miller wrote:
>
>     You hit it with memories. My great uncle made his own tractors,
>     and so my early memories are of tractor shows. I loved the big
>     tractors and steam engines, I was knee high to a grasshopper, so
>     they were really impressive. Still are now that I'm big. They are
>     mostly unaffordable, but I want a 60/30 heavy oil pull.
>
>     The first tractor I ever drove was a model titan that my great
>     uncle built. He sold that and build a second which I now have.
>     Turns out to be my goto tractor for fun, it starts easy and is
>     easy to drive. You can't do much with only 3 horse power, but I
>     don't have much to do. I've never been a farmer.
>
>     My model John deere D is built on a 1.5 horse John deere e hit n
>     miss. It is fun to drive, though my son (now 5) doesn't let me
>     often. Generally I walk beside it for safety while he drives.
>
>     My grey tractor is the last one I have that my great uncle made.
>     In my memories it is yellow and had a now missing log splitter
>     attached. Someday to I need to build one to get it right. This is
>     my only tractor with electric start, something I can do without:
>     electric start tractors were too modern to get into shows when I
>     was a kid. (this is probably not true, but in my memory...)
>
>     The other tractors in my memory are from my dad's side, he was a
>     farmer at one time and still kept the tractors. He traded a
>     Ford-Ferguson for an 8n. I remember with my cousin trying to push
>     it to prove how strong we were (now that I'm older I wonder if
>     taking it out of gear might have made us successful).  Until she
>     died a couple years ago I wanted to take it with her to a show
>     with it just to hear the announcer say "that is the original owner
>     driving". This tractor now belongs to my uncle.
>
>     Then grandpa bought a Ford 860, this is the tractor of my dad's
>     memories, he has 3 when it showed up and that was very exciting
>     for him. Now my dad has it.
>
>     Last grandpa bought a John deere B for cheap at an auction because
>     nobody else was bidding. My dad drove it home (5 miles or so). Now
>     it is my big tractor as my son calls it. It is mostly used for hay
>     rides.
>
>     Last is a homemade lawn tractor that grandpa made from a David
>     Bradley and model A Ford parts. It runs but the clutch needs work
>     so it doesn't drive. This was mostly built as a pto for a grain
>     elevator.
>
>     I moved to Moline IL a month ago, I have a  40x60 poll barn to
>     store this all in. However getting boxes unpacked has been using
>     most of my limited time. The B did get put to some use getting
>     everything to the trailer. I haven't had the energy to write
>     anything about the move though.
>
>     -- 
>
>       Henry Miller
>
>     hank at millerfarm.com <mailto:hank at millerfarm.com>
>
>     On Wed, Feb 13, 2019, at 9:39 PM, Spencer Yost wrote:
>
>         Why did you own what you have owned?  Farmer started it; as he
>         usually does....
>
>         The preponderance of narrow front tractors a tractor shows is
>         sort of a weird variation on self-selection bias. When people
>         collect tractors, they tend to collect what caught  their
>         interest when they were younger and imprinted in their
>         memories.  So their memories are screaming “let me into the
>         sample!“.  Those memories are reinforced by nostalgic pictures
>         of Farmall Ms, John Deere A’s, etc.
>
>         Having lived in Pennsylvania, and seen many horses but very
>         few tractors, I don’t  really have a bias that I can sense and
>         explains the menagerie of tractors I have owned.
>
>          I bought my Farmall A because it was close, handy, and i knew
>         of a mower i could put on it.  I bought my Pacer because i was
>         looking for a project, it was close, from a co-worker, it was
>         handy, and it was a good price even though it was rusted
>         stuck. Every tractor was a weird twist of fate. I’ve inherited
>         one(friend who passed), got a call out of the blue, you name
>         it.  I have probably owned around 30 tractors; they have all
>         come and gone after I got them running and made them happy(a
>         few went to scrap when I made a mistake in assessment). They
>         are a complete smorgasbord of anything and everything you can
>         imagine.
>
>         I’ve settled on my Ford 861, MH Pacer and JD 430V. I’ll
>         probably die with these.  If there is any pattern, it is
>         obvious that I prefer tractors from the 50s.
>
>         My collection pride and joy was a complete set of the Massey
>         Harris “equine” tractors. I had a Pony, Pacer, Colt and a
>         Mustang. A guy came along and offered me more money than I
>         could refuse and now they are gone. My original Pacer remains.
>
>         In addition I rebuilt the engines  of 6-8 tractors in this
>         area around 1990-2000.  I still see a few mowing and
>         brush-hogging from time to time. That’s  probably my greatest
>         reward.
>
>         A friend recently said he is about to give me his family’s
>         Ford  8N  for engine rebuilding. Hopefully I can post on that
>         from time to time(Don’t hold your breath: he said that a year
>         ago too. :-) ).
>
>         Spencer Yost
>
>         On Feb 13, 2019, at 9:14 PM, Indiana Robinson
>         <robinson46176 at gmail.com <mailto:robinson46176 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>             You are right Greg, my 4020 Deere was narrow front. Not my
>             first choice but it was a very good buy on a very good
>             tractor. It did have the Roll-a-matic and that did help a
>             lot on handling and ride. It was also very heavy and thus
>             quite stable.
>
>             For most things wide front / narrow front doesn't really
>             matter to me I have always adapted easily, even to a #%&^
>             hand clutch.  :-)
>
>             My father's first tractor, a 9N Ford, bought new in early
>             1942, of course, an adjustable wide front. My grandfather
>             never owned a tractor nor a car/truck, only horses.
>
>             The rebuilt McCormick 10-20, acquired during those tractor
>             shortage post war years mentioned was a "standard tread"
>             wheat-land style front axle. It was traded for a decent
>             1939 Chrysler sedan in 1951.
>
>             The Ferguson TO-20, bought new about 1949 was an
>             adjustable wide front.
>
>             By 1952 - 53 my older sister and I were putting in hours
>             running tractors and my father became largely committed to
>             low slung wide front tractors for safety reasons. About
>             1952 a John Deere MC crawler came to the farm and I spent
>             a lot of time on it and later the Deere 40C crawler,
>             bought new, that the MC was traded in on. Is a crawler a
>             "wide front"?  :-)  Very high stability.
>
>             In very early 1954 the 9N was traded for the 1953 Ford
>             Jubilee, of course also a wide front low slung tractor.
>             That one had 2 clutches, one foot and one hand for live PTO.
>
>             The Deere 40C was traded for a IHC 300U, also low and wide
>             front.
>
>             I don't actually ever recall ever even driving a tricycle
>             front tractor until we got the Allis Chalmers C that a
>             close family friend had bought new in 1946 and owned for
>             20 years. We used it a lot for stationary PTO use like
>             elevators and augers and using the mid-mount sickle mower.
>             I still have that tractor and it has been to a number of
>             shows.
>
>             We stayed with ear corn longer than most, we had a
>             Kentucky connection who would pay a premium for good ear
>             corn for cattle feed. My father found a very good used New
>             Idea 2 row mounted picker with mountings for a Farmall M.
>             We found a good Farmall Super M tricycle (that I still
>             have) to mount that picker on. I then found my Farmall
>             Super MTA tricycle which was ideal for that picker with
>             independent PTO and TA. (I still have that one too) It has
>             been to Portland before.
>
>             The Farmall 400 LP bought just because we wanted it is a
>             wide front. I still have it but it is not currently
>             running, needs an engine rebuild.
>
>             The MM-R with a #$%^ hand clutch, is a narrow front. Still
>             have it, bought it at an uncle's auction. It has been
>             shown a number of times including Portland.
>
>             The 1948 John Deere A is a Roll-a-matic narrow front with
>             a #$%^ hand clutch.
>
>             Ferguson TO-20 (not our old original) wide front. Used
>             almost daily.
>
>             1946 Case VAC, narrow front, also in regular use.
>
>             1947 Farmall Cub and a (I forget the year) Massey Harris
>             Pony. Both wide front but not very wide.  :-)
>
>             I almost forgot my MF-165D wide front. I have some of it
>             apart but maybe I will get there next fall. Priorities are
>             different when you no longer actually farm...
>
>             Oh and 2 8N Fords. One nearly done and one not started on
>             and not really a priority.
>
>             Also a Case VAC that hasn't decided if it is a project or
>             a parts tractor. A narrow front.
>
>             I guess That's everybody.
>
>             I guess that my biggest complaint about narrow fronts is
>             how they can turn into virtual bulldozers in extremely
>             soft wet soil.
>
>             Speaking of moving tractors around, I see a lot of single
>             fronts at shows here these days but I never saw any of
>             them growing up...
>
>             .
>
>             On Wed, Feb 13, 2019 at 6:40 PM Greg Hass <ghass at m3isp.com
>             <mailto:ghass at m3isp.com>> wrote:
>
>                 This is a question I have wondered about for years
>                 although it is not
>
>                 world changing. The question is: why are some areas
>                 mostly wide front
>
>                 and others narrow front tractors?  In our area of
>                 Michigan, as soon as
>
>                 wide front became available almost 100% went with wide
>                 front.
>
>                 Personally, I hate narrow front tractors with a
>                 passion. I would never
>
>                 get a narrow front tractor except maybe an old 2
>                 cylinder JD or
>
>                 something like a Farmall F-12 where wide front either
>                 did not exist or
>
>                 is extremely rare. I know that in some areas the
>                 larger tractors had
>
>                 narrow front because of mounted corn pickers. From
>                 videos other areas
>
>                 had narrow fronts. If you Google  ( tractors from the
>                 past, plowing in
>
>                 1962) you will find many tractors plowing but I didn't
>                 see a single wide
>
>                 front even on a couple new generation JD's. I don't
>                 know where the video
>
>                 was filmed but I suspect Indiana because of the fields
>                 and the way they
>
>                 raised the plows to go over grassed waterways;
>                 something I still see
>
>                 when we travel there to see our kids. I'm not sure,
>                 but I think the 4020
>
>                 Farmer used to own had a narrow front. Also why does
>                 no one make narrow
>
>                 front anymore? In the video, even the Ford disking has
>                 a narrow front,
>
>                 something I have never seen in our area and in years
>                 past there were a
>
>                 lot of Fords around us. Comments anyone.
>
>                           Greg Hass
>
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>             -- 
>
>             -- 
>
>             Francis Robinson
>
>             aka "farmer"
>
>             Central Indiana USA
>
>             robinson46176 at gmail.com <mailto:robinson46176 at gmail.com>
>
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