[AT] Canola to diesel

Sun Feb 4 20:19:14 PST 2007

Are you sure your not Walt?

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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "George Willer" <gwill at gwill.net>
To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'" 
<at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 10:37 PM
Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel

>I explained it but I guess you don't understand.  It isn't compression.
>
> George
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
>> bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Tom Yasnowski
>> Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 9:21 PM
>> To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>>
>> If my MB doesnt ignite from a spark plug than what causes the ignition?
>> Pre-chambers' warm the fuel but does not ignite it- Compression does.
>>
>>
>>
>> >Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> >To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'"
>> ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> >Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> >Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 20:23:04 -0500
>> >
>> >Tom,
>> >
>> >What you say may be mostly true, but you left out compression ignition
>> >which
>> >they are not.  Whether it is truly diesel or not doesn't depend on my
>> >opinion or yours.  I have no interest in Super Bowl.
>> >
>> >George Willer
>> >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
>> > > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Tom Yasnowski
>> > > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 7:04 PM
>> > > To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> > > Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> > >
>> > > I cant speak for the new MB's, but If the old mercedes are not true
>> > > diesels
>> > > then today isnt super bowl sunday. If it sounds like a diesel, smells
>> >like
>> > > a
>> > > diesel, takes diesel fuel, has lousy pickup and
>> > > starts hard in the cold, has 260K + miles and still purrs, and can 
>> > > run
>> > > straight vegetable oil to boot, and doiesnt have spark plugs,then by
>> > > gollly,
>> > > its a diesel!.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > >From: "George Willer" <gwill at gwill.net>
>> > > >Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> > > >To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'"
>> > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> > > >Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> > > >Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 16:34:26 -0500
>> > > >
>> > > >I don't think any basic changes can be retroactive.  It's been about
>> 17
>> > > >years since I drove any Mercedes regularly.  As far as I know the
>> 190,
>> > > >190DC, 200D, 220D, 240D, and 300D remain pre-chamber engines.  As
>> best
>> >I
>> > > >can
>> > > >tell they are NOT true diesels.  The only Mercedes I currently own 
>> > > >is
>> a
>> > > 450
>> > > >SLC and it's too valuable to drive.
>> > > >
>> > > >George Willer
>> > > >
>> > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
>> > > > > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Tom Yasnowski
>> > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 3:09 PM
>> > > > > To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> > > > > Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> > > > >
>> > > > > "Pre chamber"?  Sounds like you are talking about a IDI engine. 
>> > > > > I
>> > > think
>> > > > > most of them are DI engines
>> > > > > now....
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > >From: "George Willer" <gwill at gwill.net>
>> > > > > >Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> > > > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> > > > > >To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'"
>> > > > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> > > > > >Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> > > > > >Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 13:54:53 -0500
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >Mike,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >Maybe I was a bit hasty... maybe it's only the auto engines I'm
>> >quite
>> > > > > >familiar with that aren't true diesels.  They are NOT 
>> > > > > >compression
>> > > > > ignition,
>> > > > > >a requirement for diesel, as I understand the term.  They have a
>> > > >throttle
>> > > > > >plate that restricts the intake severely at low speeds, 
>> > > > > >resulting
>> >in
>> > > > > >compression ratios far below those required for true diesel
>> > > >operation...
>> > > > > >possibly less than 3:1 at idle.  This throttle plate is not to 
>> > > > > >be
>> > > > > confused
>> > > > > >with the safety plate working like a check valve to prevent the
>> > > engine
>> > > > > from
>> > > > > >running backward.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >They require glow plugs for starting and a heated ball pin
>> (acting
>> > > like
>> > > >a
>> > > > > >constant glow plug) for continued running.  A broken ball pin
>> will
>> > > make
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > >cylinder unable to fire.  The injectors feed into a pre-chamber
>> > > > > containing
>> > > > > >both the glow plug and the heated ball pin.  The combustion
>> begins
>> > > >there
>> > > > > >and
>> > > > > >is forced through an orfice into the main combustion chamber.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >It's understandable that many Mercedes owners aren't aware of 
>> > > > > >the
>> >odd
>> > > > > >ignition system since it's unlikely many even consider working 
>> > > > > >on
>> > > them.
>> > > > > Of
>> > > > > >the eight I've owned 6 have been "diesels" and I've completely
>> > > rebuilt
>> > > > > most
>> > > > > >of them.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >George Willer
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
>> > > > > > > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Mike Sloane
>> > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 12:50 PM
>> > > > > > > To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Mercedes aren't true diesels? You have to explain that one,
>> > > George!
>> > > > > > > Mercedes Benz (aka Daimler Benz) probably makes more diesel
>> > > engines
>> > > > > > > (car, trucks, marine, industrial, etc.) than any other single
>> > > > > > > manufacturer in the world, and if they aren't "true" diesels,
>> it
>> > > >will
>> > > > > be
>> > > > > > > a surprise to a LOT of owners/operators. :-)
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Mike
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > George Willer wrote:
>> > > > > > > > Mercedes has different ideas about diesel fuel... possibly
>> > > because
>> > > > > >they
>> > > > > > > > aren't true diesels some other concoctions are suggested.
>> >They
>> > > >even
>> > > > > > > endorse
>> > > > > > > > adding a significant amount of gasoline to the diesel in
>> cold
>> > > > > weather
>> > > > > >to
>> > > > > > > > improve starting.
>> > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > George Willer
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > --
>> > > > > > > Mike Sloane
>> > > > > > > Allamuchy NJ
>> > > > > > > <mikesloane at verizon.net>
>> > > > > > > Website: <www.geocities.com/mikesloane>
>> > > > > > > Images: <www.fotki.com/mikesloane>
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > It's hard to argue against cynics - they always sound smarter
>> > > > > > > than optimists because they have so much evidence on their
>> side.
>> > > > > > > -- Molly Ivins 1944-2007
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