[AT] Canola to diesel

Sun Feb 4 19:37:34 PST 2007

I explained it but I guess you don't understand.  It isn't compression.

George

> -----Original Message-----
> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
> bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Tom Yasnowski
> Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 9:21 PM
> To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
> Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
> 
> If my MB doesnt ignite from a spark plug than what causes the ignition?
> Pre-chambers' warm the fuel but does not ignite it- Compression does.
> 
> 
> 
> >Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> >To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'"
> ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> >Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
> >Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 20:23:04 -0500
> >
> >Tom,
> >
> >What you say may be mostly true, but you left out compression ignition
> >which
> >they are not.  Whether it is truly diesel or not doesn't depend on my
> >opinion or yours.  I have no interest in Super Bowl.
> >
> >George Willer
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
> > > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Tom Yasnowski
> > > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 7:04 PM
> > > To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
> > > Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
> > >
> > > I cant speak for the new MB's, but If the old mercedes are not true
> > > diesels
> > > then today isnt super bowl sunday. If it sounds like a diesel, smells
> >like
> > > a
> > > diesel, takes diesel fuel, has lousy pickup and
> > > starts hard in the cold, has 260K + miles and still purrs, and can run
> > > straight vegetable oil to boot, and doiesnt have spark plugs,then by
> > > gollly,
> > > its a diesel!.
> > >
> > >
> > > >From: "George Willer" <gwill at gwill.net>
> > > >Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> > > >To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'"
> > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> > > >Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
> > > >Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 16:34:26 -0500
> > > >
> > > >I don't think any basic changes can be retroactive.  It's been about
> 17
> > > >years since I drove any Mercedes regularly.  As far as I know the
> 190,
> > > >190DC, 200D, 220D, 240D, and 300D remain pre-chamber engines.  As
> best
> >I
> > > >can
> > > >tell they are NOT true diesels.  The only Mercedes I currently own is
> a
> > > 450
> > > >SLC and it's too valuable to drive.
> > > >
> > > >George Willer
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
> > > > > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Tom Yasnowski
> > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 3:09 PM
> > > > > To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
> > > > > Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
> > > > >
> > > > > "Pre chamber"?  Sounds like you are talking about a IDI engine.  I
> > > think
> > > > > most of them are DI engines
> > > > > now....
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >From: "George Willer" <gwill at gwill.net>
> > > > > >Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> > > > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> > > > > >To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'"
> > > > > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> > > > > >Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
> > > > > >Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 13:54:53 -0500
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Mike,
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Maybe I was a bit hasty... maybe it's only the auto engines I'm
> >quite
> > > > > >familiar with that aren't true diesels.  They are NOT compression
> > > > > ignition,
> > > > > >a requirement for diesel, as I understand the term.  They have a
> > > >throttle
> > > > > >plate that restricts the intake severely at low speeds, resulting
> >in
> > > > > >compression ratios far below those required for true diesel
> > > >operation...
> > > > > >possibly less than 3:1 at idle.  This throttle plate is not to be
> > > > > confused
> > > > > >with the safety plate working like a check valve to prevent the
> > > engine
> > > > > from
> > > > > >running backward.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >They require glow plugs for starting and a heated ball pin
> (acting
> > > like
> > > >a
> > > > > >constant glow plug) for continued running.  A broken ball pin
> will
> > > make
> > > > > the
> > > > > >cylinder unable to fire.  The injectors feed into a pre-chamber
> > > > > containing
> > > > > >both the glow plug and the heated ball pin.  The combustion
> begins
> > > >there
> > > > > >and
> > > > > >is forced through an orfice into the main combustion chamber.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >It's understandable that many Mercedes owners aren't aware of the
> >odd
> > > > > >ignition system since it's unlikely many even consider working on
> > > them.
> > > > > Of
> > > > > >the eight I've owned 6 have been "diesels" and I've completely
> > > rebuilt
> > > > > most
> > > > > >of them.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >George Willer
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
> > > > > > > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Mike Sloane
> > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 12:50 PM
> > > > > > > To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [AT] Canola to diesel
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mercedes aren't true diesels? You have to explain that one,
> > > George!
> > > > > > > Mercedes Benz (aka Daimler Benz) probably makes more diesel
> > > engines
> > > > > > > (car, trucks, marine, industrial, etc.) than any other single
> > > > > > > manufacturer in the world, and if they aren't "true" diesels,
> it
> > > >will
> > > > > be
> > > > > > > a surprise to a LOT of owners/operators. :-)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > George Willer wrote:
> > > > > > > > Mercedes has different ideas about diesel fuel... possibly
> > > because
> > > > > >they
> > > > > > > > aren't true diesels some other concoctions are suggested.
> >They
> > > >even
> > > > > > > endorse
> > > > > > > > adding a significant amount of gasoline to the diesel in
> cold
> > > > > weather
> > > > > >to
> > > > > > > > improve starting.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > George Willer
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Mike Sloane
> > > > > > > Allamuchy NJ
> > > > > > > <mikesloane at verizon.net>
> > > > > > > Website: <www.geocities.com/mikesloane>
> > > > > > > Images: <www.fotki.com/mikesloane>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > It's hard to argue against cynics - they always sound smarter
> > > > > > > than optimists because they have so much evidence on their
> side.
> > > > > > > -- Molly Ivins 1944-2007
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