[AT] Roto Balers - was Re: history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTO

Sat May 29 12:02:23 PDT 2021

I would imagine that Roto Balers aren't that hard to find...but 
operable, or near-operable ones these days are probably quite another 
matter. While most of the parts are pretty much 'out in the open' they 
are awfully complex. Oddly, the one thing that you might expect to be 
the most troublesome - the belts - was, in my experience, one of the 
least problematic. I don't recall that we ever broke a belt; once in a 
while the lacing at the splice would start to come undone, but that 
wasn't a big deal as long as you fixed it right away. Most, if not all 
of the bearings on the thing were standard bearings that any supplier 
(at least, any of them back in the 1970s) either kept in stock or could 
easily obtain. It might be harder now...but in southern Indiana in the 
1960s and 70s, any town of 10,000 or bigger had a decent industrial 
supplier. If they didn't have what we needed, they could get it from 
Indianapolis or Louisville in a day or two.

You're quite right that they are difficult to transport - the 
side-by-side nature of the drawbar and the pickup makes the machine very 
wide - dangerous on main highways and aggravating on back roads through 
narrow stone culverts. Then there was the fun we had working it through 
our woods to get to the hill field on the northeast side of our farm - 
there were about 20 acres of pasture/hay field that had two ways in, 
both of them involving trails 'right through the trees' - more than 
once, the first trip back there in the spring to mow involved using a 
chainsaw to clear the road. When we planted most of the farm in trees 
around 20 - 25 years ago, that nearly-inaccessible field was one of the 
first to be set...too remote from the house and too steep to raise crops 
on it.

Back on subject...there was a 'short run' of Roto Balers built by Allis 
sometime in the 1970s or maybe early 80s - they were built to the 
original design, and I don't think there were more than a few hundred 
made. If you could find one of those, it might be in better shape than 
the 'original' run, which was 1950-something as I recall.

Mark J

On 5/29/2021 11:28 AM, Spencer Yost wrote:
> I always wanted a Roto Baler. I don’t have a single sane, logical 
> reason other than I just love to watch them in action. Since I have 
> small acreage I thought it would be interesting to try to use one. 
>  Unfortunately they were never popular around here so I would have to 
> haul one in from afar and they are difficult to transport. So I’ve 
> never had the opportunity to buy one that was in good enough shape to 
> be worth the effort to transport.
>
> Plus it would take up a lot of my nonexistent shed space.  (-:  I 
> could not keep it out of the rain without erecting a shed.   The 
> lumber would cost more than the rotobaler (-:
>
> Spencer
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On May 29, 2021, at 10:57 AM, Mark Johnson 
>> <markjohnson100 at centurylink.net> wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> Herb & all:
>>
>> I remember that we had two different JD A's and a 620 when I was 
>> growing up...the 'old' A definitely did not have live PTO. The 'new' 
>> A (pressed steel frame instead of cast iron) *might* have had live 
>> PTO; I just don't recall. The 620 and everything later that we had, 
>> all definitely had live PTO. We used the 620 and 730s to power our AC 
>> roto baler.  The IH 300 would have had enough power, but lacked the 
>> live PTO, so it got relegated to rake duty. My dad said this of the 
>> original AC roto baler design: "I never baled with it without 
>> something breaking during the day. But I also never failed to finish 
>> baling what we had raked and ready." Admittedly, ours was old, and 
>> had been extensively rebuilt. Even at that, the latch plates that 
>> held the upper and lower belt gangs in the 'roll a bale" position had 
>> some wear, and would occasionally release without being tripped - 
>> either while we were running twine, or even before that. I always 
>> thought of it as the baler "throwing up" on us.
>>
>> If the bale hadn't been partially tied, we just carried the hay back 
>> around to the pickup deck and ran it through again :-).
>>
>> For myself, I always thought of the AC Roto-Baler as being an 
>> engineer's dream and a mechanic's nightmare. Lots of manual operation 
>> (stopping to feed twine manually, then tripping the release to eject 
>> the bale every time. I heard some tales that there was a later 
>> version, never produced or built only in small quantities, that had a 
>> way to 'hold' hay while the twine feed was running, so the operator 
>> didn't have to stop for each bale. I can only imagine the mechanical 
>> complexity of such a beast. Can anybody confirm or deny?
>>
>> Mark J
>>
>> On 5/29/2021 9:34 AM, Cecil Bearden wrote:
>>>
>>> I think the earliest live PTO was on the WD Allis Chalmers.  Built 
>>> to power the AC roto baler.  The hand clutch stopped forward travel 
>>> and left he PTO running.   I really liked running my old WD, just 
>>> hated the seat.  I still have kinks in my back from it...
>>> Cecil
>>>
>>> On 5/28/2021 9:05 PM, HERBERT METZ wrote:
>>>> Dean, I certainly agree and hope that purists pick up on this by 
>>>> sharing their knowledge of history of these two PTO systems.  Herb(GA)
>>>>> On 05/28/2021 4:36 PM Dean VP <deanvp at att.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Herb,
>>>>>
>>>>> In addition to your question when did LIVE PTO arrive and what 
>>>>> tractor Manufacturer provided it.  I do believe there is a 
>>>>> distinction needed to be made between INDEPENDENT LIVE PTO and 
>>>>> LIVE PTO for the purists
>>>>>
>>>>> Dean VP
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:* AT <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> *On Behalf Of 
>>>>> *HERBERT METZ
>>>>> *Sent:* Sunday, May 23, 2021 4:19 AM
>>>>> *To:* Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group 
>>>>> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>>>>> *Subject:* [AT] history of PTO's on tractors
>>>>>
>>>>> When did PTO's first appear on tractors? I assume sickle bar 
>>>>> mowers was one of the first implements that PTO's appeared on?
>>>>>
>>>>> I use an Allis Chalmers  PTO powered four foot tiller behind my 
>>>>> AC720 large lawn tractor; sure is a nice way to till our large 
>>>>> vegetable garden.
>>>>>
>>>>> Herb(GA)
>>>>>
>>>>
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