[AT] repairing machined arts

Wed Dec 11 05:42:28 PST 2019

I've been watching some back episodes of Jay Leno's Garage "Restoration
Blog" on Youtube.  He makes pretty frequent references to 3D printing.  I
believe what he's doing is printing patterns for investment casting.  The
actual casting process is most likely done by a job-shop.  Spencer's
Lulzbot has a good explanation of the process:

https://www.lulzbot.com/learn/tutorials/3d-print-patterns-investment-casting

Basically the molds are ceramic, not sand, and the pattern is consumable,
not removable.  Very good tolerances are achievable, unlike sand casting.

SO

On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at 9:54 PM Spencer Yost <spencer at rdfarms.com> wrote:

> I’ve mentioned here before that I got a Lulzbot TAZ-6 3D printer in a
> professional raffle.
>
>
> I’ve used it enough to know that the real value for average antique
> tractor folks is in making patterns for molds.  I did make a small pulley
> that was a very unusual size for a non-antique tractor application and it
> has held up well.  But it was for a small fractional horsepower motor and
> there is no real torque applied.  The motor has since died before the
> pulley.  Besides maybe the occasional knob for a dashboard control or other
> odd small non-metallic piece (I made an insulator for a magneto once) I
> can’t think of too many other antique tractor uses.
>
> Getting it into a drawing is non-trivial and filament choice for the print
> is pretty critical too.
>
> Spencer
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Dec 7, 2019, at 12:20 PM, Stephen Offiler <soffiler at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 
> The bronze is infiltrated into the pores in the steel part after the 3D
> printing process.  That's not helping in any way to keep to fine steel
> powder from wanting to oxidize before the 3D printing process even begins.
> The info is out there and I haven't found it yet.  Either the "steel" being
> discussed is actually closer to a stainless steel, or there is some kind of
> protective environment, or *something*.  Not saying that steel 3D printing
> isn't a thing; just saying it's got a challenge associated with it
> that isn't a factor in less reactive metals like titanium, aluminum, fancy
> nickel alloys (common in aerospace) etc.
>
> SO
>
>
> On Sat, Dec 7, 2019 at 11:32 AM <szabelski at wildblue.net> wrote:
>
>> I believe they add bronze to the mixture when doing steel (???). Again,
>> if I get the time this weekend, l’ll try to do some research.
>>
>> Carl
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Stephen Offiler <soffiler at gmail.com>
>> To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> Sent: Sat, 07 Dec 2019 07:35:57 -0500 (EST)
>> Subject: Re: [AT] repairing machined arts
>>
>> The short answer here is "any metal that can be made into an extremely
>> fine
>> powder".  Steel and iron present a real challenge as the extremely small
>> particles want to oxide very quickly.  Not sure how they're getting this
>> under control (suspect alloys and/or inert gas environments) but 3D folks
>> are claiming steel capabilities.
>>
>> SO
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 9:42 PM <szabelski at wildblue.net> wrote:
>>
>> > Using 3D printing for metal parts consists of laying down a film of
>> metal
>> > powder that is fused together by laser. You just keep applying layers of
>> > the metal powder to build up the part. The laser only fuses the powder
>> were
>> > the CAD model tells it to.  Although the process it similar the 3D
>> printing
>> > of plastic parts, there no plastic involved. Not 100% sure which metals
>> > they can do that way, but I believe titanium, aluminum, steel, bronze,
>> (and
>> > I also believe maybe iron), parts can be made.
>> >
>> > Carl
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: Ken Knierim <ken.knierim at gmail.com>
>> > To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group <
>> at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> > Sent: Fri, 06 Dec 2019 20:38:10 -0500 (EST)
>> > Subject: Re: [AT] repairing machined arts
>> >
>> > Yes, they have a Mythbusters Junior show (which inspired my son to want
>> to
>> > be on the show) and some other spinoffs.
>> > As far as printed parts taking over for more traditional (casting and
>> > machining), I still believe in "good, fast, or cheap. Pick 2".
>> > I use printed parts in different designs but nothing seriously
>> structural.
>> > And if I want something to last, it's usually NOT plastic.
>> >
>> > Call me old fashioned.
>> >
>> > Ken in AZ
>> >
>> > On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 3:57 PM <szabelski at wildblue.net> wrote:
>> >
>> > > If you remember the TV series “Myth Busters”, there is a new show
>> emceed
>> > > by one on the guys (believe it’s Jamie), who does a lot of similar
>> things
>> > > to what they did on MB. I caught one show where they were making an
>> > Ironman
>> > > suit made from titanium so they could prove/disprove some of its
>> > > capabilities. Some of the parts for the suit of armor were made using
>> 3D
>> > > printing and powdered titanium. Didn’t take that long to make the
>> parts.
>> > I
>> > > think I also saw a program somewhere were something was being made
>> using
>> > > powdered iron (????).
>> > >
>> > > Don’t know how well other metals could be adapted to a process like
>> that,
>> > > but if the technology can be properly developed, and the cost can be
>> kept
>> > > down, could this be the beginning of the end for all types of
>> > machined/cast
>> > > parts? If so, would a repair shop still have to carry a large
>> inventory
>> > of
>> > > parts, or just make a needed part using a 3D printer and the proper
>> > > material on the spot as needed?
>> > >
>> > > “Yes sir, you say you need a new engine block for your 1920 vintage
>> > > tractor? Just come back tomorrow and it’ll be ready.”
>> > >
>> > > Carl
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: Ken Knierim <ken.knierim at gmail.com>
>> > > To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group <
>> at at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> > >
>> > > Sent: Fri, 06 Dec 2019 15:16:47 -0500 (EST)
>> > > Subject: Re: [AT] repairing machined arts
>> > >
>> > > Some progress has been made toward taking digital photographs of the
>> > > original part and creating a 3D model from them (photogrammetry). I
>> have
>> > > the software (as part of a 3D printer package) but have not tried it
>> yet
>> > so
>> > > I cannot vouch for the accuracy. I'm still new to 3D printing but
>> we've
>> > > already put several parts into production systems... it's got its
>> place.
>> > > The photogrammetry process might be a decent place to start if you
>> want
>> > to
>> > > make a casting but I'd question accuracy for finished parts. The laser
>> > scan
>> > > technique would be better in my opinion.
>> > >
>> > > Something along similar lines for making parts is 3D metal printing.
>> The
>> > > Rutherford rocket engines are made using this technology. It uses an
>> > > electron beam rather than a laser for melting the metal and requires a
>> > > vacuum chamber for manufacturing but obviously works with high
>> pressures
>> > > and temperatures.
>> > >
>> > > Photogrammetry software:
>> > > https://all3dp.com/1/best-photogrammetry-software/
>> > >
>> > > Rutherford rocket engine:
>> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rutherford_(rocket_engine)
>> > >
>> > > I see these as interesting ways of creating parts. As with anything,
>> it's
>> > > going to take some work to perfect. I doubt it would be affordable for
>> > > tractor parts for awhile.
>> > >
>> > > Ken in AZ
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 10:48 AM Jack <jacktractor at live.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > The shortcoming of this for the repair of unavailable tractor parts
>> is
>> > > > that you need a Cad file of a good part first.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>> https://www.imeche.org/news/news-article/feature-retrofit-transforms-legacy-machine-tools-to-keep-worn-parts-in-use?utm_campaign=PE%20newsletter%2C%206%20December&utm_source=email&utm_medium=PE%20Newsletter
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