[AT] Tesla Factory (OT)

Cecil Bearden crbearden at copper.net
Tue Apr 26 06:36:03 PDT 2016 

Just a small funny thing about the electric cars.......     My wife & I 
bought some electric 20V jackets from Dewalt.  They were on special and 
really cost only a few dollars more than buying their 20V batteries for 
my 20V tools.   In the reviews of the jackets, the majority of folks 
wore them when making long commutes in electric cars In the frozen North 
of the US.  It seems the heater and defroster reduces your mileage a lot!!!

When it comes to fuel, I really believe Propane cannot be beat.  I grew 
up with Propane.  If the engine was really built to get the most 
efficiency out of the fuel, Propane was more cost efficient even when 
the prices went up.   I was involved with Oklahoma buying prototype 
Natural gas trucks for the agencies.  We tried out a Chevy 3/4 ton.  It 
has 3 tanks installed in the frame and the bed...  However, the engine 
was a Medium duty truck engine so it could have the stellite valves and 
seats.  however the stupid engineer who designed it did not take into 
account that Natural gas needs more than 7:1 compression ratio to run 
efficiently....    I took the truck out the first day and made 3 trips 
around the state capitol while "playing with the acceleration".  I 
nearly had to push it into the refuelling station!!!

We ran propane on our pickups from 1971 until the early 1990's.  I had a 
65 Chevy pickup w/ 283 & powerglide that took me 120 miles a day 4 days 
a week while I was going to OK state Univ.  It saved me half versus 
living in that high priced college town... I got 10mpg on propane and 12 
on gas...    I had a 60 gallon tank in the bed.   When I sold that 
pickup it had over 185000 miles and never used a drop of oil...  I 
turned the speedometer back to 95K and sold it!!!  I saw the truck about 
5 years later while as a farm auction and the owner just loved it.  He 
said he had only put valve cove gaskets on it and it was showing nearly 
95K miles, so it had to have nearly another 100K miles on it...   This 
was without any special valves...

We cannot run propane on the later Chevy engines due to the plastic 
manifolds.  I have not tried the Ford engines due to not having adapters 
and not having access to a supplier who will not charge 3 prices for the 
adapters.   However, I have converted most of my other gas engine 
forklifts, swather, and other tractors to propane.  I am presently 
converting my Sullair compressor to propane as soon as I get the engine 
rebuilt.   The only objection I have when driving a propane tractor is 
that without a cab, the heat from the exhaust is really something to 
deal with on a hot day..  That 4010 on LP has more heat coming off that 
muffler than the heat from the radiator fan....

My point is that we have one of the most environmentally friendly fuels 
readily available if the distribution network would be built.   It would 
require some training to get the drivers able to fuel them safely, but 
they would have to put down the I phone to do it......  The propane tank 
is lighter than that battery, and it lasts a lot longer than the natural 
gas tank that has to be replaced every 6 years....

Cecil in OKla



On 4/25/2016 7:22 PM, Len Rugen wrote:
> I got a 2010 Honda Civic Hybrid "butt buggy" for commuting. It lets me keep a 20 year old Dodge 4x4 5.9l that will pass anything but a gas station.  I bought it a year old, just before a gas price spike, for what I could have bought a new base model Civic.  I'm 6' 6", so good MPG options are limited, but that car is surprisingly roomy.  I considered the Chevy Volt, but they were expensive at the time, I couldn't even find one, but someone said they are the same body as the Cruze, I tried one on, it wasn't a fit for my knees.
>
> Having a spare vehicle removes me from being a mechanic's hostage. If one needs work, I can diagnose and decide if it's economical for me to fix it or hire it done.
>
>
> Len Rugen
>
> rugenl at yahoo.com
>
>
>   
>
>      On Monday, April 25, 2016 6:20 PM, Spencer Yost <yostsw at atis.net> wrote:
>   
>
>   I will jump in here. There are few  points that help with the discussion
>
> The first point is to keep this list somewhere near antique stuff:  If anyone is serious about the environmental and social damage of automobiles, you should keep all the old ones on the road. Much of the damage is done manufacturing vehicles - especially electric vehicles - and  not operational.
>
> While traveling you are recharging on an electrical grid that is powered by the fuel that makes the most sense for that area. For example you might be charging with electricity made with natural gas in Pennsylvania but nuclear in Arizona or oil in North Dakota .  This assumes market forces are minimizing the environmental costs of transporting fuel.
>
> Pollution for electric vehicles is centralized in the smokestacks. Ostensibly that should mean there is a better job of cleaning up. I do understand that's a debatable. Considering the electrical utilities are not held to task as tightly as they should be in this regard.
>
> Range is a mute point once you feel the acceleration of the Tesla :-) - at least that's what an acquaintance told me after he  drove one.
>
> Some points to ponder…
>
> Spencer Yost
>
>> On Apr 25, 2016, at 3:36 PM, Henry Miller <hank at millerfarm.com> wrote:
>>
>> You miss the point, most people do not drive long distances often. I work with people with various electric cars, all have other cars, they wouldn't use their commuting car for family trips anyway. Thus the range argument is moot.
>>
>> As for fuel, the great advantage of electric is it can be anything. When coal is cheap use that, if wind or solar are cheap (or you want to pay extra to be green), it still works. If the mythical fusion reactor still works you are still good.
>>
>> I've come close to running out of fuel cause I couldn't find a diesel pump in the city I was in.
>>
>> Most quotes or price say the cost of electric is equivalent to gas at $1/gallon. I bought my car because the fuel savings over my truck was greater than the payment.
>>
>> Again if you only make long distance trips the electric car is not for you. However for most families that buy new cars having an electric in the mix makes sense. It won't work for everything, but it will be better for some things and so it balances out. (I specified new because used electric cars are not well available in the used market yet, and mechanics don't know how to evaluate them yet)
>>
>>
>>
>>> On April 25, 2016 1:52:29 PM CDT, charlie hill <charliehill at embarqmail.com> wrote:
>>> So you recharge them what... every 80 miles?
>>> How long does it take?  Certainly a lot longer than
>>> it takes me to pump 22 gallons of gasoline in my
>>> 4 wd pickup truck that allows me to drive 400 plus miles
>>> before needing to be refilled?  What kind of fuel do they
>>> use to make the electricity for the charging station?  Coal,
>>> bunker C oil, natural gas, nuclear power?  What is your time
>>> worth while you are waiting .... what 4 hours for every hour you drive
>>> to recharge?
>>>
>>> I have no problem with electrical motors driving vehicles, Diesel over
>>> electric
>>> works very well for locomotives and heavy construction equipment.  Not
>>> so
>>> much for small cars used for anything other than a short daily commute.
>>>
>>> Stephen,  just so you don't miss it this time, these are rhetorical
>>> questions
>>> intended to make a point.  They don't require your reply.
>>>
>>> Charlie
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Stephen Offiler
>>> Sent: Monday, April 25, 2016 2:20 PM
>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Tesla Factory (OT)
>>>
>>> Tesla has two networks of charging stations:
>>>
>>> 1)  "Destination" charging stations, at hotels, restaurants, malls,
>>> etc.
>>> Map:
>>> https://www.teslamotors.com/destination-charging
>>>
>>>
>>> 2)  "Supercharger" stations.  Map:
>>> https://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 25, 2016 at 1:06 PM, Dick Day <dickday0 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I believe most of the charging stations are located near other
>>> businesses.
>>>> I think he found many to be either near or at a mall.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 25, 2016 at 9:59 AM, charlie hill
>>> <charliehill at embarqmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What does he do with his time while waiting at the charging station
>>> for
>>>> it
>>>>> to recharge?
>>>>>
>>>>> Charlie
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DDSS, Inc.
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2016 1:32 PM
>>>>> To: 'Antique tractor email discussion group'
>>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Tesla Factory (OT)
>>>>>
>>>>> My son in Chicago has a P85.  That is an incredible car.  There is
>>> a
>>>>> button, I believe it's called the insane/insanity button (cannot
>>>> remember).
>>>>> I work for the county.  On one of my son's trips here to Nebraska,
>>> he
>>>>> brought it to the jail and took some of the deputies for a 'ride'.
>>> One
>>>>> deputy said that when my son hit the button and then floored it, he
>>> left
>>>> a
>>>>> new "tuck" in the naugahyde seat.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are enough charging stations between here and Chicago that he
>>> had
>>>> no
>>>>> problems.
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
>>>>> [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Spencer
>>> Yost
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2016 11:46 AM
>>>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Tesla Factory (OT)
>>>>>
>>>>> Yea.  Very cool.  Everyone's read a lot about their factory and
>>> methods
>>>>> but
>>>>> the video make its real.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Dave,
>>>>>
>>>>> Spencer Yost
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Apr 24, 2016, at 8:29 AM, Bo Hinch <bohinch at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> as usual , I enjoyed the short film .
>>>>>> Thanks Dave
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sat, Apr 23, 2016 at 6:39 PM, Dave <rotigel at me.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> See: http://biggeekdad.com/2013/09/tesla-motors-factory/
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>>>>>
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