[AT] Off Topic, Logging property

Sun Sep 23 17:38:40 PDT 2012

In Texas....My land,
My trees,
My way !!! When I need firewood I draw on the dead first. ( much like
the democrats when they are looking for new voters)
 There are always some that have succumbed to the ravages of time and
simply 'fall down'. Then and only the are they of use to my chain saw.

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 23, 2012, at 10:57 AM, Paul Waugh <paul at plwaugh.com> wrote:

> I can't seem to find anything on Google about what KA is ... must not be
> important.
> Paul
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
> [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Dave Rotigel
> Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2012 9:13 AM
> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> Subject: Re: [AT] Off Topic, Logging property
>
> Didn't someone once say "Those who give up their liberty for security live
> in KA and vote for OBAMA"?
>    Dave
>
> On Sep 23, 2012, at 7:15 AM, charlie hill wrote:
>
>> I think Mr. Jefferson made the definitive statement on this subject a
>> few hundred years ago.  Unfortunately we didn't listen well.
>>
>> "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the
>> blood of patriots and tyrants. ... God forbid we should ever be twenty
>> years without such a rebellion; what country can preserve its
>> liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their
>> people preserve the spirit of resistance?  Let them take arms." --
>> Thomas Jefferson to William Stephens Smith, 1787
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Mike Meulenberg
>> Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2012 12:44 AM
>> To: at
>> Subject: Re: [AT] Off Topic, Logging property
>>
>> But therin lies the problem Grant, you see the old trees once
>> established have figured out how to pass rules in the forest to make
>> sure they never get pruned. They take fruit and seeds from some
>> plants, and distribute them to other plants and animals in the forest,
>> making sure those plants and animals know that the old trees where
>> responsible for their freebies. Now when it comes time to get pruned
>> guess who is seen as too valuable to prune? Why of course it's the old
>> trees who provide for all the other plants animals of the forest, with
>> things that don't belong to them in the first place. Mike M
>>
>>
>> ----- Receiving the following content -----
>> From: Grant Brians
>> Receiver: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> Time: 2012-09-21, 11:54:35
>> Subject: Re: [AT] Off Topic, Logging property
>>
>>
>> Every so often a
>> massive pruning is just smart. When did we have a massive pruning
>> last???? I look forward to that happening, but also a society of law
>> is not Socialism, it is a functioning society.
>>      Grant Brians
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com]On Behalf Of Dave Rotigel
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 4:22 PM
>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> Subject: Re: [AT] Off Topic, Logging property
>>
>>
>> You mean that in KA there are still some areas where an individual
>> still has the freedom to use their personal property as they see fit?
>> This is NOT GOOD! VOTE OBAMA and and MORE socialism!
>> Dave
>> PS, "Land of Fruits and Nuts"? Now I understand!
>>
>> On Sep 19, 2012, at 2:00 PM, Grant Brians wrote:
>>
>>> Here in California we have two basic classes of forest - those in
>>> areas where there are controls enforced and those where the controls are
> not.
>> The
>>> Santa Cruz Mountains near us are one of the areas that are managed
>>> forests that the timber companies only harvest in ways that are
>>> sustainable and everyone involved KNOWS that the plan will be
>>> followed. On the other hand, even though plans are required for any
>>> forests, here in my county, there
>> are
>>> people that just indiscriminately cut down the old growth oak and
>>> pines
>> and
>>> assume the state's foresters will not catch them or will just
>>> admonish
>> them.
>>> I know of one rancher that is a terrible offender like this, but so
>>> far
>> the
>>> forester has not been able to prove that the rancher is the one doing
>>> the work because the forester covers an area about the size of Sweden....
>>> Firewood collection is something that is needed from some of our
>>> forests to assure the larger trees make it to harvest maturity
>>> because of the low precipitation levels of much of California. But at
>>> the same time intelligence is CLEARLY needed to retain the soils
>>> (nearly all forest in California is on hillsides or mountainsides,
>>> much of which exceeds 30% grades and some as much as 75%) and to keep
>>> the proper mix of plants to support wildlife and control erosion.
>>> Some states do not require forest management plans, but thankfully we
>>> do - the lack thereof in past times
>> led
>>> to spectacular flood events and property and habitat destruction, we
>> learned
>>> the hard way and with many lawyers and insurance companies involved....
>>> Grant Brians
>>> Hollister,California Vegetable, Fruit and Nuts farmer
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
>>> [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com]On Behalf Of Mattias
>>> Kessen
>>> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 1:47 PM
>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Off Topic, Logging property
>>>
>>>
>>> You Americans never seize to surprise. No offense but is it common to
>>> own forest without a plan and harvest often for firewood. I'm
>>> beginning to question my understanding of the English language and I
>>> know little about modern forest industry here but... I'm surprised.
>>> I've always thought forest to be a long term investment. Once again
>>> no offense I'm aware that our societies are very different and can't
>>> be compared therefor (which is very apparent when you read most
>>> Swedish newspapers reporting from USA, using our standards for you is
> absurd as the other way around).
>>> I think I've got to pour me another whisky here in the sauna and read
>>> more of Arto Paasilinnas great authorship.
>>>
>>> Mattias
>>> Den 17 sep 2012 16:22 skrev "Mark Greer" <markagreer at embarqmail.com>:
>>>
>>>> You need to create a "Timber Management Plan". This involves having
>>>> a qualified forester advise/help you develop a plan for your
>>>> woodlot's specific conditions and your specific intentions for it.
>>>> You will
>>> inventory
>>>> and value trees which have good potential and then develop a plan to
>>>> help them reach that potential at a faster rate. This involves
>>>> Timber Stand Improvement (TSI) work which may include selective
>>>> thinning around crop trees, trimming/removing grape vines, selective
>>>> harvesting for timber, etc., etc. It is an ongoing process but can
>>>> be financially very much
>> worth
>>>> your while. Your local Ag Extension service would be one place to
>>>> start looking for this information to get started. Pennsylvania DCNR
>>>> is also a good place to start looking for information.
>>>>
>>>> http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/forestry/privatelands.aspx
>>>>
>>>> An active Timber Management plan is a must for land owned where you
>>>> plan to sell timber some day. The tax ramifications of not having a
>>>> documented working plan can make it not worth selling timber because
>>>> you stand to
>>> lose
>>>> so much of a sale to taxes. By inventorying and valuing the trees at
>>>> the time of land purchase and then looking at the difference in
>>>> value at the time of sale, you can count a sale as a capital gain
>>>> and only owe the
>>> lower
>>>> capital gains tax rate on the difference (the capital gain) vs. just
>>>> selling timber and paying the higher income tax rate on the WHOLE sale.
>>>> Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, I think I'm going to contact an un-biased forester and create a
>>>> logging plan.
>>>>
>>>> Hopefully we will follow the plan and there will be no surprises in
>>>> the family.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you everybody for the information.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Will
>>>> SE PA
>>>>
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