[AT] JD 214 WS timing problems

[carl gogol]

Brad - Thanks for the description, it makes sense and like I said, I haven't 
been intimate with a baler in 42 years.  I can't remember a time when we had 
to mess with a knotter except to clear the gob and retie the string after a 
twine roll change.-- well except for the time my father decided that because 
the wagons had long tongues he would get them a little closer to the baler 
by shortening the baler's hitch.  The hitch was adjustable by removing a pin 
and sliding one pipe further into another.  All it would take is to drill a 
couple of 1/2" holes into one piece that for some reason New Holland was too 
cheap to do!  He didn't realize that the free (back)end of the adjustable 
hitch on the baler was now protruding to the point where the needle yoke 
would hit it before fully penetrating to the knotter.  We wasted about 4 
hours and half a dozen shear pins one otherwise productive afternoon 
figuring that one out.
I just have one other thing that I remember - the needles would get shiney 
after a few thousand bales - what would they have  been rubbing on if not 
hay?
thanks
Carl Gogol - Manlius, NY
Tasty grazing in the Oran valley of Central NY
AC D14, 914H
JD 5320 MFWD
Kubota F-2400, B7300HST
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brad Gunnells" <brad-gunnells at uiowa.edu>
To: "Antique tractor email discussion group" <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2009 9:19 AM
Subject: Re: [AT] JD 214 WS timing problems


> Actually the needles clear the plunger, not really the other way
> around. The plunger is at full stroke compressing the hay in the
> chamber. The needles pass up through the slots in the plunger to lay
> the twine/wire into the knotter. The knotter assembly wraps the knot
> and cuts the twine/wire. Then the needles retract and the plunger
> rescinds. As the hay leaves the bale chamber it expands from it's
> compressed state and causes the knots (in twine) to tighten.
>
> The stop that is being hit by the plunger is there in case the
> needles move from their parked position before the full stroke on the
> plunger. Otherwise the compressed  hay would likely bind or break the
> needles. The needles never really touch the hay, they merely are the
> transport to get the bottom side twine/wire passed up to the knotters.
>
> Funny how intimate you get with the workings of these thing when they
> don't want to cooperate.
>
> Brad
>
> On Nov 18, 2009, at 6:55 PM, Lew Best wrote:
>
>> Thanks Carl
>>
>> There are slots in the plunger head on this one that clear the
>> needles even
>> on full compression.  Not sure the reason for the safety stop since
>> that's
>> the case but I'm sure there's a reason for it.  Anyway, there's one
>> part of
>> the timing instructions that's just a tiny bit vague & I've studied
>> out the
>> parts drawing (after I gave up again when dark caught me); I think
>> I've been
>> lining everything up by turning the flywheel the wrong direction;
>> if so that
>> would throw everything off so maybe tomorrow.........
>>
>> Lew
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of carl gogol
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 18, 2009 6:31 PM
>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> Subject: Re: [AT] JD 214 WS timing problems
>>
>> I know it has been a very long time since I was around a baler, but
>> on a New
>>
>> Holland baler it seems like the plunger was at the maximum distance
>> away
>> from the needles when the knotter tripped, not at the closest point
>> or near
>> to it.  The safety bars stopped the plunger from entering the
>> needle area
>> while tying was taking place in case timing was off.  This would be
>> enough
>> to pop the flywheel shear bolt and stop the plunger from smashing
>> into the
>> needles. Just my recollection from circa 1967 and it could be wrong,
>> distorted or just a teenager's view.  The knotter ties a loose
>> string and
>> the tension mechanism forms the bale by stretching it and thereby
>> tightening
>>
>> the string.  It does not require a fully compacted bale during
>> knotting - in
>>
>> fact I'm not sure the needles could penetrate a fully compacted bale
>> reliably.
>> Carl Gogol - Manlius, NY
>> Tasty grazing in the Oran valley of Central NY
>> AC D14, 914H
>> JD 5320 MFWD
>> Kubota F-2400, B7300HST
>>
>> -----
>>
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