[AT] Canola to diesel

Mon Feb 5 08:36:05 PST 2007

Well put.

-----Original Message-----
From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
[mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of charlie hill
Sent: Monday, February 05, 2007 6:55 AM
To: Antique tractor email discussion group
Subject: Re: [AT] Canola to diesel

Tom,  the Diesel engine (large D) was designed by a man named Diesel who had

a patent on it.  There are other engine designs that burn fuel oil but they 
aren't true Diesels unless they are designed according to the Diesel patent.

I don't know enough to explain it but it has to do with how the fuel oil is 
injected, pre-heated and fired.  diesel (small d) has become a generic term 
for all fuel oil burning engines in the same way that some folks used to 
call any refrigerator a Frigidair.

Charlie
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tom Yasnowski" <tomyasnowski at hotmail.com>
To: <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 7:04 PM
Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel

>I cant speak for the new MB's, but If the old mercedes are not true diesels

>then today isnt super bowl sunday. If it sounds like a diesel, smells like 
>a diesel, takes diesel fuel, has lousy pickup and
> starts hard in the cold, has 260K + miles and still purrs, and can run 
> straight vegetable oil to boot, and doiesnt have spark plugs,then by 
> gollly, its a diesel!.
>
>
>>From: "George Willer" <gwill at gwill.net>
>>Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group 
>><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>>To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'" 
>><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>>Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 16:34:26 -0500
>>
>>I don't think any basic changes can be retroactive.  It's been about 17
>>years since I drove any Mercedes regularly.  As far as I know the 190,
>>190DC, 200D, 220D, 240D, and 300D remain pre-chamber engines.  As best I 
>>can
>>tell they are NOT true diesels.  The only Mercedes I currently own is a 
>>450
>>SLC and it's too valuable to drive.
>>
>>George Willer
>>
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
>> > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Tom Yasnowski
>> > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 3:09 PM
>> > To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> > Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> >
>> > "Pre chamber"?  Sounds like you are talking about a IDI engine.  I 
>> > think
>> > most of them are DI engines
>> > now....
>> >
>> >
>> > >From: "George Willer" <gwill at gwill.net>
>> > >Reply-To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> > >To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'"
>> > ><at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>> > >Subject: RE: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> > >Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 13:54:53 -0500
>> > >
>> > >Mike,
>> > >
>> > >Maybe I was a bit hasty... maybe it's only the auto engines I'm quite
>> > >familiar with that aren't true diesels.  They are NOT compression
>> > ignition,
>> > >a requirement for diesel, as I understand the term.  They have a
>>throttle
>> > >plate that restricts the intake severely at low speeds, resulting in
>> > >compression ratios far below those required for true diesel
>>operation...
>> > >possibly less than 3:1 at idle.  This throttle plate is not to be
>> > confused
>> > >with the safety plate working like a check valve to prevent the engine
>> > from
>> > >running backward.
>> > >
>> > >They require glow plugs for starting and a heated ball pin (acting 
>> > >like
>>a
>> > >constant glow plug) for continued running.  A broken ball pin will 
>> > >make
>> > the
>> > >cylinder unable to fire.  The injectors feed into a pre-chamber
>> > containing
>> > >both the glow plug and the heated ball pin.  The combustion begins
>>there
>> > >and
>> > >is forced through an orfice into the main combustion chamber.
>> > >
>> > >It's understandable that many Mercedes owners aren't aware of the odd
>> > >ignition system since it's unlikely many even consider working on 
>> > >them.
>> > Of
>> > >the eight I've owned 6 have been "diesels" and I've completely rebuilt
>> > most
>> > >of them.
>> > >
>> > >George Willer
>> > >
>> > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
>> > > > bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of Mike Sloane
>> > > > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 12:50 PM
>> > > > To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> > > > Subject: Re: [AT] Canola to diesel
>> > > >
>> > > > Mercedes aren't true diesels? You have to explain that one, George!
>> > > > Mercedes Benz (aka Daimler Benz) probably makes more diesel engines
>> > > > (car, trucks, marine, industrial, etc.) than any other single
>> > > > manufacturer in the world, and if they aren't "true" diesels, it
>>will
>> > be
>> > > > a surprise to a LOT of owners/operators. :-)
>> > > >
>> > > > Mike
>> > > >
>> > > > George Willer wrote:
>> > > > > Mercedes has different ideas about diesel fuel... possibly 
>> > > > > because
>> > >they
>> > > > > aren't true diesels some other concoctions are suggested.  They
>>even
>> > > > endorse
>> > > > > adding a significant amount of gasoline to the diesel in cold
>> > weather
>> > >to
>> > > > > improve starting.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > George Willer
>> > > >
>> > > > --
>> > > > Mike Sloane
>> > > > Allamuchy NJ
>> > > > <mikesloane at verizon.net>
>> > > > Website: <www.geocities.com/mikesloane>
>> > > > Images: <www.fotki.com/mikesloane>
>> > > >
>> > > > It's hard to argue against cynics - they always sound smarter
>> > > > than optimists because they have so much evidence on their side.
>> > > > -- Molly Ivins 1944-2007
>> > > > _______________________________________________
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