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p.MsoNormal,p.MsoNoSpacing{margin:0}</style></head><body><div style="font-family:Arial;">My wife keeps wanting an rv, she grew up with one and remembers it being fun. I keep refusing: just the difference in gas over the minivan pays for the hotel room every night with enough left over for lunch. A campstove would let me cook nearly anything. <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;">RVs make sense when you go somewhere not too far from home and stay there for a while. My family is all too far away for that to work. Maybe if I went to Portland for the entire show, (my son will be in school and disappointed if I went without him so that is out) it would work. </div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div id="sig11221025"><div class="signature">-- <br></div><div class="signature"> Henry Miller<br></div><div class="signature"> hank@millerfarm.com<br></div><div class="signature"><br></div></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;">On Tue, Feb 26, 2019, at 11:45 PM, Cecil Bearden wrote:<br></div><blockquote type="cite" id="fastmail-quoted"><p>We have a 73 Monaco Class C on a 1 ton Dodge frame. It was a
fiberglass body and had a futuristic fiberglass dash. I got it
home and it had some water damage around the top vent in the back
above the toilet. when I took the ceiling paneling down I found
that a pack rat had filled the ceiling and the cavity between the
wall and ceiling both sides from front to rear. I was filled with
sticks, feces, straw, paper, anything that was less than 2 inches
long was in there...It sat under the shed for over 30 years until
I pulled it out to put a couple of Cadillacs in out of the
hail.. It will never get repaired... Just too much work. Due
to the tire size, 7.00x17, Tires would be over $2000 to put it on
the road.... Also, the water damage was all over. The fiberglass
roof was one piece that wrapped down the sidewall about 6 inches
and was installed first at the factory, then the sides were put on
over the roof wraparound. The seam was covered with a piece of L
shaped carpet edging... It was a leak waiting to occur from the
factory... At the time Monaco was supposed to be a good
coach.... <br></p><p>We don't travel much anymore, by the time we haul in our cpap
machines and pills, and suitcases, and provisions for our furry
child, it is just too much trouble. With 50 head of cattle and a
bunch of equipment to take care of I don't like to be gone
long....<br></p><p>Cecil<br></p><div class="fastmail-quoted-moz-cite-prefix">On 2/26/2019 10:44 PM, <a href="mailto:deanvp@att.net" class="fastmail-quoted-moz-txt-link-abbreviated">deanvp@att.net</a> wrote:<br></div><blockquote cite="mid:035301d4ce57$2d80cf40$88826dc0$@att.net" type="cite"><div class="fastmail-quoted-WordSection1"><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Cecil,</span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">We owned a
38’ Montana 3400RL for 11 years. I won’t go into all the
problems we had with it that were primarily due to bad
construction quality. Montana is the highest volume 5<sup>th</sup> wheel brand in the US and is a division of Thor. I never
expected to have to learn so much about RV’s in order to
keep it road worthy or useable.. It was our first RV other
than a truck camper we had when the kids were small. It was
a top of the line model and was not inexpensive. But we
never had an outing where we did not have something fail.
Fortunately I have enough skills that I was able to fix
many of the problems myself. If we would have had to have a
dealer fix everything we would have bought the RV twice.</span><span style="background-color:white" class="highlight"><span style="color:rgb(51, 51, 51)" class="colour"><span style="font-family:Georgia, serif" class="font"><span style="font-size:11.5pt" class="size"> I must admit that I learned things that I never expected to
or really wanted to. But it didn’t take long where it really
started to be extremely annoying. Our primary usage was our
5 months each year in AZ. I could write a book about things
we had to deal with but one of my favorite excuses that is
present in the RV community is as follows: If you pulled
your stick built house down the road like you do your RV you
have problems with that too. My response to all that is I
didn’t buy a stick house to pull down the road, I bought a
RV that was supposedly designed to be pulled down the road.
We paid more for our RV than we did the truck when it was
new. But… it pulled that RV 3200 miles round trip to AZ and
back for 11 years. The truck never failed in any way even
when it had over 180,000 miles. The RV was a constant
nightmare. Truck and RV were on the same roads and exposed
to the same environment. The RV drove me nuts so we finally
sold it. Still own the truck and I will probably be buried
in it. So our introduction to larger RV’s was quite an
experience. I will mention one of the problems that
occurred on the 5<sup>th</sup> wheel that I never fixed
primarily because it was so minor and I enjoyed showing
visitors the defect.</span></span></span></span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="background-color:white" class="highlight"><span style="color:rgb(51, 51, 51)" class="colour"><span style="font-family:Georgia, serif" class="font"><span style="font-size:11.5pt" class="size"> </span></span></span></span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="background-color:white" class="highlight"><span style="color:rgb(51, 51, 51)" class="colour"><span style="font-family:Georgia, serif" class="font"><span style="font-size:11.5pt" class="size">On our first trip to AZ the first night I discovered a hinge
pin rolling around the floor in the kitchen. Really had me
confused as to how it was possible for a pin to work its way
up out of a hinge. I dropped in a drawer since there were
other things requiring my attention but in the back of my
mind I was very puzzled as to where it had come from and how
a hinge pin could go vertical. Well, eventually I found the
door where the hinge pin was missing. Then I really got
confused. The button top for the pin was still on the hinge.
That really had me going. But other things were more
important to address, like a chandelier that had come loose
from the ceiling and shattered in a million pieces on the
floor.. But this little mystery always was floating around
in my head while driving down the road. I finally figured
out what had happened and I felt like I was a complete
brainless Neanderthal. Then I started laughing at myself.
What had happened was the hinge had been mounted upside
down on the folding door and the pin just fell out like one
would expect. I never fixed it in the 11 years we owned the
RV. I had a lot of fun showing the anomaly to visitors and
observing their reaction. We were told by Montana that we
had gotten a Lemon. I asked them if ours was a Lemon how
come so many other Montana owners were experiencing the same
quality issues. </span></span></span></span><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Conversations
became very short. If you want an RV that really looks good
and has lots of sizzle Montana is the brand. If you want an
RV that is made with real quality, I have yet to find a
brand I can recommend. Most are made by Thor subsidiaries
and there is a rush to the bottom quality wise. We were a
stranger to the RV industry and they took us in. But if you
want to know how to fix many of the problems that show up on
RV’s, I became an expert. That and $2.00 might get me a cup
of coffee.</span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Dean VP</span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Apache
junction, AZ</span><br></p></div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><div><div style="border-right-width:initial;border-bottom-width:initial;border-left-width:initial;border-right-style:none;border-bottom-style:none;border-left-style:none;border-right-color:initial;border-bottom-color:initial;border-left-color:initial;border-image-source:initial;border-image-slice:initial;border-image-width:initial;border-image-outset:initial;border-image-repeat:initial;border-top-width:1pt;border-top-style:solid;border-top-color:rgb(225, 225, 225);padding-top:3pt;padding-right:0in;padding-bottom:0in;padding-left:0in;"><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">From:</span></b><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> AT <a href="mailto:at-bounces@lists.antique-tractor.com" class="fastmail-quoted-moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"><at-bounces@lists.antique-tractor.com></a> <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Cecil Bearden<br> <b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, February 26, 2019 8:48 PM<br> <b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:at@lists.antique-tractor.com" class="fastmail-quoted-moz-txt-link-abbreviated">at@lists.antique-tractor.com</a><br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: [AT] OT shifting blame</span></p></div></div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"> <br></p><p></p><div style="font-family:Arial;">Dean:<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> Thanks for straightening me out. Back when we bought our 21ft
Airstream from a former dealer, the owner told us that Thor
corporation had bought Airstream from Beatrice Foods. I
questioned him at the time about that being the air tool
company and he said it was... Thor Pneumatic tools was
bought out by Stewart-Warner... <br></div><p></p><p>Granted Airstream has had a lot of problems with their
trailers since the mid 90's. Frame problems especially.
The older models were well built, but their problem was
leaking around the windows and the riveted seams in the
shell.. The leakage would rot the plywood floor and the
floor supported the shell. To replace the floor the shell
needs to be lifted from the frame and there is an aluminum
angle that sets on the floor and attaches the shell.
Replacement of our 21ft floor would take at least 100 man
hours... It is now too good to scrap, and too bad to really
use like we want to...<br></p><p>Cecil<br></p><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal">On 2/26/2019 9:02 PM, <a href="mailto:deanvp@att.net">deanvp@att.net</a> wrote:<br></p></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt;"><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Cecil,</span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Interesting
observations. That I have no argument with but one
comment woke me up.</span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">“
Airstream trailers was bought by Beatrice foods, then sold
to Thor Corporation. “”” manufacturer of air tools”””
As far as I know Thor Corporation that bought Airstream is
the largest RV Manufacturer in the US with a large variety
of brands. I’m not aware of them being into air tools.
Did I miss something? BTW, in line with your
discussion…. Airstream had a pretty good reputation for
quality, however since the Thor manufacturing policies
have been instituted the Airstream Quality has steadily
declined noticeably. Thor’s primary focus is to strip
the costs out of the RV, focus on producing more units
faster at less cost and selling sizzle rather than
substance. Thor’s stock has steadily declined and IMHO the
Thor management is trying to squeeze every dime out of the
multiple brands before abandoning them and sailing off in
the sunset with their ill-gotten gains. Just look into
Markus Lemonis and what he and his minions are really
doing at Thor. It is sickening. The RV industry has a
poor reputation for quality products. Markus is driving
that quality reputation to new lows.</span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Dean VP</span><br></p><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">Apache
junction, AZ</span><br></p></div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> </span><br></p><div><div style="border-right-width:initial;border-bottom-width:initial;border-left-width:initial;border-right-style:none;border-bottom-style:none;border-left-style:none;border-right-color:initial;border-bottom-color:initial;border-left-color:initial;border-image-source:initial;border-image-slice:initial;border-image-width:initial;border-image-outset:initial;border-image-repeat:initial;border-top-width:1pt;border-top-style:solid;border-top-color:rgb(225, 225, 225);padding-top:3pt;padding-right:0in;padding-bottom:0in;padding-left:0in;"><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour">From:</span></b><span style="color:windowtext" class="colour"> AT <a href="mailto:at-bounces@lists.antique-tractor.com"><at-bounces@lists.antique-tractor.com></a> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Cecil Bearden<br> <b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, February 26, 2019 11:39 AM<br> <b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:at@lists.antique-tractor.com">at@lists.antique-tractor.com</a><br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: [AT] OT shifting blame</span></p></div></div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"> <br></p><p>That town is no different that every other factory town
that lost the main workplace when the manufacturer went
offshore, or just went belly up. Massey went bankrupt due
to some bad management decisions and changes in Farming.
Allis Chalmers died due to the Germans buying them out and
changing the engine design. White motor Co. bought Oliver
and Minneapolis Moline and just drained the companies of
everything. Then AGCO bought them and only kept the
planter. The later 2-105 White tractors were a later
version of the 1850 Series Oliver. One of the Best tractors
made IMO. I remember when the first Russian wheat deal was
signed and wheat went to $6 a bushel. One Week later John
Deere raised prices 20% across the board.... I can't
testify to International. IH had some problems in the
80's. I remember buying some IH stock for $6 a share in the
80's. This was when Tenneco was working on buying
International Harvester Ag. Tenneco was first a gas
transmission company... I blame many problems in
manufacturing on the big companies in the 70's thru the 90's
playing the merger acquisition game. When a company is
publicly traded and their assets are worth more than their
stock, they are in a bad position for some greedy entity to
buy their stock and dismantle the company for a fast buck.
Airstream trailers was bought by Beatrice foods, then sold
to Thor corporation, the manufacturers of air tools. Many
of these acquisitions just did not make sense and then the
companies flounder for several years before going out of
business or going offshore.... <br></p><p>Then when you have too many people with no work and the
government pays so well for not working, then you have the
drug problem... I guess the old saying Idle hands are the
Devils workforce is so true....<br></p><p>Just rambling.... Freezing drizzle for the next 36
hours here,<br></p><p>Cecil<br></p><p> <br></p><p> <br></p><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal">On 2/26/2019 12:02 PM, Stephen Offiler
wrote:<br></p></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt;"><div><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal">Your statement does not accurately
represent what the author is saying.<br></p></div><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"> <br></p></div><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"> <br></p></div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"> <br></p><div><div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal">On Sun, Feb 24, 2019 at 7:06 PM
James Peck <<a href="mailto:jamesgpeck@hotmail.com">jamesgpeck@hotmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br></p></div><blockquote style="border-top-width:initial;border-right-width:initial;border-bottom-width:initial;border-top-style:none;border-right-style:none;border-bottom-style:none;border-top-color:initial;border-right-color:initial;border-bottom-color:initial;border-image-source:initial;border-image-slice:initial;border-image-width:initial;border-image-outset:initial;border-image-repeat:initial;border-left-width:1pt;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-top:0in;padding-right:0in;padding-bottom:0in;padding-left:6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5pt;"><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"></p><div style="font-family:Arial;">This author is claiming they are
taking dope in Brantford because MF went out of
business.<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <a href="https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-in-brantfords-opioid-nightmare-a-community-sees-more-hopeful-days/">https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-in-brantfords-opioid-nightmare-a-community-sees-more-hopeful-days/</a><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> _______________________________________________<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> AT mailing list<br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <a href="mailto:AT@lists.antique-tractor.com">AT@lists.antique-tractor.com</a><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"> <a href="http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com">http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com</a><br></div><p></p></blockquote></div></div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"></p><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<br></pre><pre>AT mailing list<br></pre><pre><a href="mailto:AT@lists.antique-tractor.com">AT@lists.antique-tractor.com</a><br></pre><pre><a href="http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com">http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com</a><br></pre></blockquote><div id="fastmail-quoted-DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2"><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"> <br></p><table border="1" cellpadding="0" style="border-right-width:initial;border-bottom-width:initial;border-left-width:initial;border-right-style:none;border-bottom-style:none;border-left-style:none;border-right-color:initial;border-bottom-color:initial;border-left-color:initial;border-image-source:initial;border-image-slice:initial;border-image-width:initial;border-image-outset:initial;border-image-repeat:initial;border-top-width:1pt;border-top-style:solid;border-top-color:rgb(211, 212, 222);" class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormalTable"><tbody><tr><td width="55" style="width:41.25pt;border-top-width:initial;border-right-width:initial;border-bottom-width:initial;border-left-width:initial;border-top-style:none;border-right-style:none;border-bottom-style:none;border-left-style:none;border-top-color:initial;border-right-color:initial;border-bottom-color:initial;border-left-color:initial;border-image-source:initial;border-image-slice:initial;border-image-width:initial;border-image-outset:initial;border-image-repeat:initial;padding-top:9.75pt;padding-right:0.75pt;padding-bottom:0.75pt;padding-left:0.75pt;"><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><a href="https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=icon"><span style="text-decoration-line:none;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;"><img border="0" height="29" width="46" alt="https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif" src="https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif" id="fastmail-quoted-_x0000_i1025" style="width:0.4791in;height:0.302in;"></span></a><br></p></td><td width="470" style="width:352.5pt;border-top-width:initial;border-right-width:initial;border-bottom-width:initial;border-left-width:initial;border-top-style:none;border-right-style:none;border-bottom-style:none;border-left-style:none;border-top-color:initial;border-right-color:initial;border-bottom-color:initial;border-left-color:initial;border-image-source:initial;border-image-slice:initial;border-image-width:initial;border-image-outset:initial;border-image-repeat:initial;padding-top:9pt;padding-right:0.75pt;padding-bottom:0.75pt;padding-left:0.75pt;"><p style="line-height:13.5pt;" class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(65, 66, 78)" class="colour"><span style="font-family:Arial, sans-serif" class="font"><span style="font-size:10pt" class="size">Virus-free. <a href="https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=link"><span style="color:rgb(68, 83, 234)" class="colour">www.avast.com</span></a></span></span></span><br></p></td></tr></tbody></table></div><p class="fastmail-quoted-MsoNormal"></p><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<br></pre><pre>AT mailing list<br></pre><pre><a href="mailto:AT@lists.antique-tractor.com">AT@lists.antique-tractor.com</a><br></pre><pre><a href="http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com">http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com</a><br></pre></blockquote></div><div style="font-family:Arial;"><br></div><pre wrap="" class="fastmail-quoted-moz-quote-pre">_______________________________________________
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