[AT] Tractor battery

Sat Nov 20 04:08:36 PST 2021

I guess it depends whether this is the bolt that the alternator pivots on,
or a bolt on the slotted arm that lets you adjust belt tension.  The pivot
bolt seems like it would be OK, not so sure if it's the one out on the end
of that arm.  Carl's comment about putting it somewhere you won't need to
touch also occurred to me, but I guess we might be splitting hairs - how
often do you tension your alternator belt?  As long as you're aware that
you want to pay extra attention to the negative cable connection if you do
ever re-tension that belt, seems like it might be an acceptable solution.

SO

On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 11:38 PM HRP <hrpletch at gmail.com> wrote:

> And I don’t picture the adjusting bolt as necessarily having a good
> connection to the block for the starter current.
>
> Howard
>
> On Nov 19, 2021, at 11:32 PM, Carl Szabelski <c.s.szabelski at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> I wouldn’t use any bolt that’s primary use is for adjusting. You want a
> bolt that once tightened down, doesn’t get touched again for any reason. If
> you have to use one that isn’t as easy to get to, just keep in mind that
> you shouldn’t ever have to touch it again. Whatever effort you have to go
> through will hopefully only need to be done once.
>
> Carl
>
> On Friday, November 19, 2021, Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>
>> I have an alternator adjustment bolt that is easy access, would that be a
>> good choice?
>>
>> Mike M
>>
>> On 11/16/2021 11:34 PM, Carl Szabelski wrote:
>>
>> You can run a new cable to the engine block, just need to find a spot
>> where there is an unused threaded hole, or where you can remove a bolt and
>> use it to make the attachment. Clean the area and hit it with a file or
>> some sandpaper, then run a tap in the hole to make sure everything is clean
>> before attaching the cable. If necessary use a new bolt and flat washer,
>>  stainless will help with future corrosion issues/concerns.
>>
>> Carl
>>
>>
>>
>> On Monday, November 15, 2021, Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Tore out the battery today, tons of corrosion, to the point that the
>>> positive nut for the clamp was almost reduced by 75%, I had to pound it
>>> off. I thought I had things cleaned up but it appears that was not the
>>> case. I'll go battery shopping tomorrow, and hopefully I can find something
>>> close. Meanwhile I have the battery case coated in baking soda, to help
>>> neutralize the leaking battery acid. Question for the list can I jump a
>>> diesel, without the battery installed? I'm running out of time in Michigan,
>>> and all our water is shut off except the barn frost free.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Mike M
>>>
>>> On 11/15/2021 3:37 PM, Steve W. wrote:
>>>
>>> Not a problem, I get to deal with these things a lot. At this point even
>>> doing simple repairs are becoming hard if not impossible for the average
>>> DIYer due to the way the companies are building them. There are some out
>>> there now that have “sealed drivelines” where they have no dipsticks or
>>> easily accessible fill plugs to even do routine service and you need a scan
>>> tool to even check fluid levels!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From: *Stephen Offiler <soffiler at gmail.com>
>>> *Sent: *Monday, November 15, 2021 5:28 AM
>>> *To: *Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group
>>> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AT] Tractor battery
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Extremely useful and informative for modern vehicles, thanks SteveW!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Steve O.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 14, 2021 at 10:39 PM Steve W. <swilliams268 at frontier.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Whatever you do, do NOT use the old “unhook the battery to see if it
>>> stays running” test that used to be done. On any vehicles newer than about
>>> 1998 that is almost a guaranteed way to destroy the charging system. On
>>> most cars and trucks built from there on up, the voltage regulator is part
>>> of the engines control unit. Those are not cheap to replace. Another no-no
>>> is to jump start a newer vehicle without charging the battery or leaving a
>>> jump pack on it, many of the newer vehicles will read the bad battery and
>>> crank the voltage and amperage way up to try to compensate for the low
>>> battery, that can kill the alternator, and if the battery is failing it can
>>> blow it up from the excessive charging. I can’t count how many vehicles I
>>> had to repair once the bug measures let people start using their cars
>>> again, after they were parked for 3-4 months.
>>>
>>> Now if you are one of the “fortunate” who has one of the over engineered
>>> modern rolling computers made from about 2017 and up, Check really close in
>>> service information before you replace an old battery, many of those need
>>> to have the battery initialized into the system because the ECU has
>>> adjusted itself as the old battery wore out, you need to tell it that you
>>> are installing the new battery and what it is in CCA and type, be it a
>>> flooded cell, AGM, Lithium or other as they all use slightly different
>>> charging routines and it’s easy to cook a battery if it’s set up wrong. To
>>> go with that, many of the parts stores offer installation as long as you
>>> have one that is reasonably easy, there are quite a few that are not due to
>>> the battery locations. OH and for the import owners, be sure which battery
>>> you actually need as many of the high dollar brands use 2 or three
>>> different batteries scattered around the vehicle. Mercedes for instance has
>>> one in the trunk, one under the hood and one tucked in behind the dash!
>>>
>>> For those of you who still want to DIY it, here is another tip. On cars
>>> that have lots of options or anything 2017 and up, the security systems can
>>> be a royal pain if you remove the battery, they can lock you out of
>>> everything so you end up towing it to a dealer to have it flashed back. The
>>> way around this is simple. Find the feed and ground lugs for the fuse box
>>> or if it has them the jumper terminals mounted out in the open. Now grab a
>>> power supply or a fully charged battery and connect it up to those, in the
>>> case of using a spare battery, connect it, start the engine and let it run
>>> for 20 minutes or so, that will equalize the charge in the add-on battery,
>>> verify that the charging circuit is working as well, simply by measuring
>>> the voltage with the engine off, then again with it running. With a power
>>> supply (NOT A COMMON CHARGER) you just dial it up to the voltage the
>>> service info says or at least 13 volts. Now you can disconnect the main
>>> battery without losing any settings or programming because the ECU never
>>> sees it disconnected. Just remember that the Positive terminal will still
>>> be hot when you do this, my SOP is to pull the ground side, then take a
>>> heavy rubber/plastic baggy and as soon as the pos. comes of it goes into
>>> the bag to keep it safe.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From: *Henry Miller <hank at millerfarm.com>
>>> *Sent: *Sunday, November 14, 2021 4:23 PM
>>> *To: *at at lists.antique-tractor.com
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AT] Tractor battery
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Be careful with modern cars, some cycle the alternator on and off.
>>> Weird when driving to see the voltmeter not hold constant. (This was a
>>> rental car, I almost turned around for one that worked before I figured it
>>> out )
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>>   Henry Miller
>>>
>>>   hank at millerfarm.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 14, 2021, at 16:37, Stephen Offiler wrote:
>>>
>>> > Quick check is just battery voltage not running versus running.  If
>>> your
>>>
>>> > alternator is putting out something, voltage is higher when running.
>>> If
>>>
>>> > the alternator is bad, voltage is close to the same or a bit lower when
>>>
>>> > running (probably lower because the battery gave up some juice to
>>> crank it
>>>
>>> > over).  If you are wondering if the alternator is somewhere in between
>>>
>>> > healthy and dead, turn on as many electrical loads as you can while
>>>
>>> > running.  Alternator should handle those loads and still give the
>>> battery
>>>
>>> > terminals something over 13.5V.  (Because it is supplying other things
>>> in
>>>
>>> > addition to battery recharge, you may not see the whole 14-ish volts,
>>> but
>>>
>>> > it must be greater than 12.6-ish to be pushing charge into the battery.
>>>
>>> > Hope this helps.
>>>
>>> >
>>>
>>> > SO
>>>
>>> >
>>>
>>> >
>>>
>>> > On Sun, Nov 14, 2021 at 3:43 PM Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >
>>>
>>> >> Thanks Steve, it there a way to test whats coming out the alternator?
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >> Mike M
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >> On 11/14/2021 2:15 PM, Stephen Offiler wrote:
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >> Hi Mike:
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >> I've heard baking soda can neutralize the acid but I'd probably ask
>>> the
>>>
>>> >> Google for backup on that.
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >> A good range for battery terminal voltage engine-running is
>>> 13.6V-14.4V.
>>>
>>> >> Some modern voltage regulators have temperature compensation, dropping
>>>
>>> >> voltage in high temperature conditions (when it is easier to charge
>>> and
>>>
>>> >> easier to overdo it) and raising voltage in the cold (when they're
>>> not as
>>>
>>> >> eager to accept charge).  Not all alternators do this, but I just
>>> wanted to
>>>
>>> >> explain why there's such a fairly wide range.
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >> SO
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >> On Sun, Nov 14, 2021 at 2:03 PM Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> >>> Tough to say Steve, I do know that I filled some of the battery
>>> chambers
>>>
>>> >>> with distilled water because some seemed a little low, and it leaked
>>>
>>> >>> battery acid for a few days. whats the best way to clean that up? I
>>> know
>>>
>>> >>> it's very caustic. What should the voltage be across the terminals
>>> with the
>>>
>>> >>> engine running?
>>>
>>> >>>
>>>
>>> >>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> >>> Mike M
>>>
>>> >>>
>>>
>>> >>> On 10/28/2021 6:08 AM, Stephen Offiler wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>
>>>
>>> >>> The question is, what happened?  Is your alternator not charging?
>>>
>>> >>>
>>>
>>> >>> SO
>>>
>>> >>>
>>>
>>> >>> On Wed, Oct 27, 2021 at 9:30 PM Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>
>>>
>>> >>>> Whew!! got it back for now. It started right up and the terminals
>>> where
>>>
>>> >>>> shiny as new, ground as well. Voltage across the terminals was 13.3
>>> and
>>>
>>> >>>> climbing. I have the trickle charger on it overnight, and will give
>>> it a
>>>
>>> >>>> good workout tomorrow. Thanks for all the help!
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> >>>> Mike M
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> On 10/27/2021 1:22 PM, Mike M wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> When I checked the voltage between the posts with a digital volt
>>> meter,
>>>
>>> >>>> I only got 11.5 volts, I left the charger on overnight, and it's
>>> now up to
>>>
>>> >>>> 13 volts, so I switched to a maintainer.  It's raining here today
>>> so I'm
>>>
>>> >>>> leaving it on the charger, and yes I will check the grounds for
>>> sure!
>>>
>>> >>>> Thanks for the advice to all. I'll let you know how it turns out.
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> >>>> Mike M
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> On 10/27/2021 7:54 AM, Steve Offiler wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> I wonder how many thousands of times farmer has typed that over the
>>>
>>> >>>> years!
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> When Mike said it only clicked when jumped, that simply says bad
>>>
>>> >>>> connection.  I’m not sure why the focus on a bad battery just yet.
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> Steve O.
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> On Oct 27, 2021, at 6:47 AM, Indiana Robinson <
>>> robinson46176 at gmail.com>
>>>
>>> >>>> <robinson46176 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> 
>>>
>>> >>>> Check the grounds.
>>>
>>> >>>> Check the grounds.
>>>
>>> >>>> Check the grounds.
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> .
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> On Wed, Oct 27, 2021 at 1:22 AM Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>> Makes me wish for my old tractor and I could back it up onto a
>>> hill,
>>>
>>> >>>>> let it get rolling and pop the clutch in 2nd gear.
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>> Mike M
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>> On 10/26/2021 11:46 PM, Carl Szabelski wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>> Mike,
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>> Try jumping it, but leave the cables connected for 20-30 minutes
>>> before
>>>
>>> >>>>> you attempt a start. Even if you’ve had the charger on all night.
>>> Even with
>>>
>>> >>>>> a dead battery it should start and run. It may die when you
>>> disconnect the
>>>
>>> >>>>> cables, but if it doesn’t, it should run, but the battery probably
>>> won’t
>>>
>>> >>>>> take a charge.
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>> Carl
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>> On Tuesday, October 26, 2021, Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>>> So my tractor battery went dead overnight. It's an Exide Select
>>>
>>> >>>>>> Performance battery, with 925 CCA model 31XHE with 180 minutes of
>>>
>>> >>>>>> reserve capacity. I tried jumping it with my truck but no luck it
>>> would
>>>
>>> >>>>>> just click. I started looking online, and about fell out of my
>>> chair.
>>>
>>> >>>>>> Prices started at $300 and and most are out of stock. Does anyone
>>> have
>>>
>>> >>>>>> any good sources for batteries? It was manufactured in 2014, so I
>>> guess
>>>
>>> >>>>>> the clock just ran out. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. Is
>>>
>>> >>>>>> there
>>>
>>> >>>>>> anyway to service it, or rejuvenate it?
>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>>> Thank you,
>>>
>>> >>>>>> Mike M
>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>>
>>> >>>>>> --
>>>
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>>> >>>> --
>>>
>>> >>>> --
>>>
>>> >>>>
>>>
>>> >>>> Francis Robinson
>>>
>>> >>>> aka "farmer"
>>>
>>> >>>> Central Indiana USA
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>>> >>>> robinson46176 at gmail.com
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