[AT] history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTO

Mon May 31 07:00:15 PDT 2021

Forgot to mention that there are some other screws that are similar to the Trapease3screws. One that comes to mind is a brand called Camo.  Don’t know what price difference there may be.

Carl

----- Original Message -----
From: szabelski at wildblue.net
To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Mon, 31 May 2021 09:56:01 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: [AT] history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTO

Dean,

When I did our deck, I used clips. On the first and last boards I used Trapease3 screws on the outside edges without clips. The screws are designed with a small head that has a reverse thread at the top. When driven in, the reverse thread pulls the board in tighter and eliminates puckering of the board around the screw head. No predrilling and they come in colors that match the decking. They were suggested and provided by the Trex distributor who is the main distributor for all of southeast Michigan. Off hand I’d say the head of the screw is about 1/8 - 3/16 in diameter from memory. Not currently home so I can’t give you an actual measurement, but you can go online and probably get it. You really don’t notice them. You’ll also have the same issue with any stairs that you put in. The inner tread can be put in with clips, but the outer tread will require screws.

Carl

----- Original Message -----
From: deanvp <deanvp at att.net>
To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Sun, 30 May 2021 23:04:48 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: [AT] history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTO

Carl, Yes using clips on the composite boards is what is expected but there are more than one version of those clips.  I like the Trex version.  But there are some places where screws have to used and I just want an understanding how that is going to be done.  All the pressure treated lumber is for framing only and that isn't of concern as how it looks under the composite boards as long as it is done well. You are addressing the issue of how the remaining holes will be taken care of after inserting and sinking we below the surface. That is the very question I'm asking the potential contractors.  How are you going to do that?Sent from my Galaxy
-------- Original message --------From: szabelski at wildblue.net Date: 5/30/21  4:34 PM  (GMT-08:00) To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group <at at lists.antique-tractor.com> Subject: Re: [AT] history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTO Dean, If you’re trying to avoid screws showing in your deck, I would strongly suggest you consider using something that attaches from the sides of the boards, whether it be clips or screws. They do make screws that have small heads that allow you to screw between the boards for side attachment. You can countersink screws, but filling them in with some type of wood filler doesn’t always last long. You bound to get pops. It would be better to use wood plugs made from the same wood product glued into the counter sinks with something like epoxy,  then shaved level. Off hand I don’t remember seeing pressure treated wood plugs being sold anywhere, so you’d more than likely have to have them made, or make them yourself. Costly and time consuming.Carl----- Original Message -----From: Dean VP <deanvp at att.net>To: 'Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group' <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>Sent: Sun, 30 May 2021 16:25:39 -0400 (EDT)Subject: Re: [AT] history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTOMike, Do you mean by “white board” Pine, Fir or Hemlock? I need to check but I believe I have heard others talking about 8’ 2 x 4’s running $8 apiece.  .    Have been to lumber stores recently looking at deck stuff bit haven’t looked at 2 x 4 x 8’ since they are not used much in a deck.  I need to look at pressure treated lumber too since all wood under the composite deck boards will be treated lumber.  I just received a  quote on what a right angle corner bench 10 x 6’ mounted to the joists and built out of the same composite boards used on the deck as an increase to the existing quote….$1800. The previous quote supposedly included benches.  I’m dumfounded by the quotes I  am getting. I may be trying to do something that is out of the ordinary for today’s contractors.  I’m trying to nail down the details so that there aren’t add-on charges during the project.   That may exclude some bidders in today’s market place.   I make decisions on what contractors I might be able to trust based on their responses to me trying to nail down details.  The lowest price is third down the list is 1.) A trustworthy contractor and a 2.) deck built to expectations and layout.  I’m finding that some contractors don’t like being pinned down on details that are important to me.  I sure hope they aren’t trying to play games.   I think it is reasonable for me to ask when and where what type of screws will  have to be used versus which  version of clips and will the screw holes be counter sunk and filled?  Is that unreasonable?  I don’t want any more screws used than is necessary.   Dean VPSnohomish, WA 98290"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."..Winston Churchill... From: AT <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> On Behalf Of Mike MSent: Saturday, May 29, 2021 1:10 PMTo: at at lists.antique-tractor.comSubject: Re: [AT] history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTO Dean, I'd be curious to know what prices are out west. Here in Michigan a 2x4x8' white wood used to be 1.97, is now $8. I wanted to have a pole barn built but that will have to wait. A sheet of OSB is $40Mike MOn 5/29/2021 12:41 PM, Dean VP wrote:Spencer,   Never want to let the little stuff get in the way. And …. lumber is cheap right now. Just received a $40,000 quote on my $15,000 deck project. That just plain dumfounds me. Dean VPSnohomish, WA 98290"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."..Winston Churchill... From: AT  <mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> On Behalf Of Spencer YostSent: Saturday, May 29, 2021 9:28 AMTo: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group  <mailto:at at lists.antique-tractor.com> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>Subject: Re: [AT] history of PTO's on tractors .... when LIVE PTO I always wanted a Roto Baler. I don’t have a single sane, logical reason other than I just love to watch them in action. Since I have small acreage I thought it would be interesting to try to use one.  Unfortunately they were never popular around here so I would have to haul one in from afar and they are difficult to transport. So I’ve never had the opportunity to buy one that was in good enough shape to be worth the effort to transport. Plus it would take up a lot of my nonexistent shed space.  (-:  I could not keep it out of the rain without erecting a shed.   The lumber would cost more than the rotobaler (-: SpencerSent from my iPhoneOn May 29, 2021, at 10:57 AM, Mark Johnson <markjohnson100 at centurylink.net <mailto:markjohnson100 at centurylink.net> > wrote: Herb & all: I remember that we had two different JD A's and a 620 when I was growing up...the 'old' A definitely did not have live PTO. The 'new' A (pressed steel frame instead of cast iron) *might* have had live PTO; I just don't recall. The 620 and everything later that we had, all definitely had live PTO. We used the 620 and 730s to power our AC roto baler.  The IH 300 would have had enough power, but lacked the live PTO, so it got relegated to rake duty. My dad said this of the original AC roto baler design: "I never baled with it without something breaking during the day. But I also never failed to finish baling what we had raked and ready." Admittedly, ours was old, and had been extensively rebuilt. Even at that, the latch plates that held the upper and lower belt gangs in the 'roll a bale" position had some wear, and would occasionally release without being tripped - either while we were running twine, or even before that. I always thought of it as the baler "throwing up" on us.If the bale hadn't been partially tied, we just carried the hay back around to the pickup deck and ran it through again :-). For myself, I always thought of the AC Roto-Baler as being an engineer's dream and a mechanic's nightmare. Lots of manual operation (stopping to feed twine manually, then tripping the release to eject the bale every time. I heard some tales that there was a later version, never produced or built only in small quantities, that had a way to 'hold' hay while the twine feed was running, so the operator didn't have to stop for each bale. I can only imagine the mechanical complexity of such a beast. Can anybody confirm or deny?Mark JOn 5/29/2021 9:34 AM, Cecil Bearden wrote:I think the earliest live PTO was on the WD Allis Chalmers.  Built to power the AC roto baler.  The hand clutch stopped forward travel and left he PTO running.   I really liked running my old WD, just hated the seat.  I still have kinks in my back from it...CecilOn 5/28/2021 9:05 PM, HERBERT METZ wrote:Dean, I certainly agree and hope that purists pick up on this by sharing their knowledge of history of these two PTO systems.  Herb(GA)   On 05/28/2021 4:36 PM Dean VP  <mailto:deanvp at att.net> <deanvp at att.net> wrote: Herb,In addition to your question when did LIVE PTO arrive and what tractor Manufacturer provided it.  I do believe there is a distinction needed to be made between INDEPENDENT LIVE PTO and LIVE PTO for the puristsDean VPFrom: AT  <mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> On Behalf Of HERBERT METZSent: Sunday, May 23, 2021 4:19 AMTo: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group  <mailto:at at lists.antique-tractor.com> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>Subject: [AT] history of PTO's on tractorsWhen did PTO's  first appear on tractors? I assume sickle bar mowers was one of the first implements that PTO's appeared on? I use an Allis Chalmers  PTO powered four foot tiller behind my AC720 large lawn tractor; sure is a nice way to till our large vegetable garden. Herb(GA)_______________________________________________AT mailing listAT at lists.antique-tractor.com <mailto:AT at lists.antique-tractor.com> http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com_______________________________________________AT mailing listAT at lists.antique-tractor.com <mailto:AT at lists.antique-tractor.com> http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com_______________________________________________AT mailing listAT at lists.antique-tractor.com <mailto:AT at lists.antique-tractor.com> http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com_______________________________________________AT mailing listAT at lists.antique-tractor.com <mailto:AT at lists.antique-tractor.com> http://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com   <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=icon> Virus-free.  <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient&utm_term=link> www.avast.com  _______________________________________________AT mailing listAT at lists.antique-tractor.comhttp://lists.antique-tractor.com/listinfo.cgi/at-antique-tractor.com
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