[AT] Lawn mower carburetors are a piece of cake..... Wrong

[drgerber at bright.net]

God bless Farmer and Diana on their HAPPY ANNIVERSARY!

 

Dave Gerber, OH

 

From: AT <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> On Behalf Of Stephen Offiler
Sent: Wednesday, June 9, 2021 8:45 AM
To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Subject: Re: [AT] Lawn mower carburetors are a piece of cake..... Wrong

 

HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to farmer and Diana! 

 

Steve O.

 

On Wed, Jun 9, 2021 at 2:13 AM Indiana Robinson <robinson46176 at gmail.com> wrote:

My wife (of 58 years today) also loves mowing. That is a good thing because we mow a lot of grass. Happily, son Scott takes care of most of the big stuff pulling a 15' bat-wing behind a MF-1155. We keep most of the horse lanes mowed with lawn mowers but he clips the horse lots 2 or 3 times a year along with a couple of acres of Scotch Pines and some Balsam Fir trees.

A few years ago I bought a Husqvarna

 27 HP 61" cut zero-turn. One of the best things I have done in some time. I had no learning curve with it, maybe because I grew up putting a zillion hours on a couple of JD crawlers. Steering with levers was very natural. I did have some trouble with stumbling over the name when speaking of it so I started referring to it as the "Aardvark" and it kind of stuck.  :-) I put Diana on it so she could try it out in a wide open space but she decided that she wanted to stay with a lawn tractor. We have a 54" cut 26 HP Poulan Pro  and a 48" cut 21 HP John Deere lawn tractor that is a back-up mower. We also have an older 46" cut 20 HP Yardman that needs some minor deck work that I am planning to move to the mini-farm (17 acres) in the next county so that I don't have to keep hauling a mower over there.

Years ago we used to mow a number of large yards and I used to maintain a few factory properties. We also used to do small engine work as a part of our store operation. We used to repair a zillion carbs (mostly cleaning and a new diaphragm) on walking mowers.

Personally I almost never have carb problems and I have always used E-10 from the pump in about everything. I rarely use any kind of stabilizer in a tank over winter, just climb on and start them up. I do sometimes add a few ounces of oil to the fuel tank when I am working one particularly hard but rarely when cutting light stuff.

We used to get in a lot of mowers that people had tried to fix at home, largely by just throwing parts at them. Most of the time they were just barking up the wrong tree and spending a lot of money. On common walking mowers the real problem was surprisingly often a slightly sheared flywheel key. Even a tiny amount of off-set in the key was enough to keep one from starting at all. We bought those keys by the hundred.

2020 really sucked in many ways and I lost quite a bit of mobility over the summer, fall and winter... Trying to fight my way back now and improving slowly. I acquired a used mobility scooter this spring, not for use here but so that I can still hold up at tractor shows and all day auctions.

Finally back in the shop a bit more. I think I sat a new record today... I keep an older Coats 40-40 tire changer and was putting a new set on the van. I fumbled while removing a valve core and I believe that it may have gone out the open door and joined all of those zillions of WD-40 little red tubes that have been launched into the stratosphere over the years. See, I do still remember some old discussions here...   :-)

 

On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 8:48 PM Jim Thomson <macowboy at comcast.net <mailto:macowboy at comcast.net> > wrote:

Cutting the lawn is also one of my wife's favorite things to do. In Massachusetts we had a Cub Cadet with a 50" deck and a Kawasaki engine to cut 1.5 acres. She loved this little tractor. I also bought her a Sthil blower and string trimmer. Fast forward to Iowa where we have a solid 4 acres of lawn to cut. Our current mower is a Kubota B2301 with a 60" 3 pt finish mower. I have to give the wife lessons on this as she is a little scared of it. A funny story, last weekend our farmer/landscaper neighbor called me and said he was coming over Sunday morning to cut our yard. There is a cemetery a half mile from us and he wanted the lawn looking good for Memorial Day . He brought over his big JD(Z945?) zero turns and asked if I wanted to try it. I gave it a try and it scared me to death. This thing had to be going 10 plus miles an hour with perfectly cut grass. This was my first time on a zero turn so there was a steep learning curve. I thought I would drive this right into the ditch. After 2 passes, I parked it and went back to the Kubota. My wife then started using the JD and did just fine with it. My neighbor created a monster and now she wants a small zero turn mower! BTW, both Sthil's and our Honda push mower always start even with old gas. My HF generator is a first pull starter too. 

  

  

  

Jim Thomson 

Blairsburg, Iowa 

Jim Thomson 

Blairsburg, Iowa 

On 06/08/2021 5:40 AM Stephen Offiler <soffiler at gmail.com <mailto:soffiler at gmail.com> > wrote: 

  

  

Couple general comments loosely related to Dean's mower and not sure how to tie in to antique tractors.   

  

One, Honda engines.  I needed a small push-mower for some tight spots on my 3-ish acres that I mow with a 48" zero-turn.  My one criteria was Honda engine.  Got one at the big-box store.  And yes that thing has absolutely never, and I am not exaggerating, never ever failed to start on the literal first pull, even in the spring after sitting for 5 months (I do use Sta-bil in my gas).  One of these days I hope to tear apart a Honda carb and maybe figure out a couple of their secrets, but I need to find a dead one first, which doesn't seem likely.   

  

Two, self-propelled.  I paid little attention to that feature when I got said Honda powered mower.  It played up the "Front-Wheel-Drive".  Sounds like a car commercial from the 1970's when that was a new thing.  Turns out there's little weight on the front wheels and none at all when you tip it back to steer it.  Stupid design, and my own damn fault for not giving it more consideration before purchase. 

  

OK, tractors... some may recall I picked up a Cub last summer with a sickle mower.  It got parked as I was very busy with home renovations at that time, with deadlines to meet.  Then it got buried at the back of the barn as winter approached.  Now I've got a couple areas I don't mow routinely,  adding up to about 1-1.5 acres, with 3' tall grasses... starting to eye that Cub again... 

  

SO 

  

 

On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 3:18 AM Dean VP < deanvp at att.net <mailto:deanvp at att.net> > wrote: 

The Lawn Mower lives. Runs pretty good too. Idle setting is a bit mysterious. Hard starting when cold. I’m not sure the choke butterfly is working properly. It’s nice and free but I can put it on full choke and nothing happens when it is running. Must be something not connected right. I did hook up the rod when installing the carb. Did find out why it was a little wimpy power wise.  The little flipper that drives the throttle butterfly needed a little adjustment. Now get full RPM’s at full throttle.   Need to try  to figure out if the choke is working properly then I think it is ready to go.  I had forgotten how useless the geared drive is. In low I can hardly keep up with it walking a fast pace. 2nd And 3rd are not useable by this old man. .Anyway, cleaning up the carb and installing the new kit gets me a running mower for my Grandson.  Need to make sure it isn’t a terribly hard starter. Not sure why it had to be so obstinate for a while

 

Dean VP

Snohomish, WA 98290

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."

..Winston Churchill...

 

From: AT <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com <mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> > On Behalf Of Cecil Bearden
Sent: Monday, June 7, 2021 5:39 AM
To: at at lists.antique-tractor.com <mailto:at at lists.antique-tractor.com> 
Subject: Re: [AT] Lawn mower carburetors are a piece of cake..... Wrong

 

I bought one of those little Stihl top handle saws nearly 10 years ago.  I love the balance of it.  I put the longest bar I could get on it from Bailey's so I could cut brush in fencerows without bending down so much.   Within 3 hours of using it, the stop switch quit working.  I have to choke it to kill it.  Still the same way 10 years later....
Cecil

On 6/7/2021 1:29 AM, Dean VP wrote:

Gene,



I’m jealous. I’m still fighting gas engines.  Your Stepson lives only 5 or so miles from us.  He is just North West Of Monroe, WA actually closer to Monroe than Snohomish with a Snohomish address.  Looks like he is up on the ridge North and above Evergreen State Fair Grounds which is the county fairgrounds.  I suspect he gets to hear the Saturday night racing at the fairgrounds really well. We are 7.5 miles out of Monroe and when the weather is right we too hear the racing. The area where he lives is just exploding with new homes since Monroe is within commuting distance of Seattle and the High Tech East side. IF… one is willing to put up with the traffic.  Monroe is right on the junction of 522 and Hwy 2y which heads over the Cascade Mountain Range to the Wenatchee area.  522 heads toward Seattle and also intersects with I405 which heads S into Bellevue.  522 is now mostly a 4 lane road but where it is still only 2 lane it is a traffic mess for commuters.  WA State DOT does not have a clue about how to build roads that not only meet current needs but maybe a few years to the future.   I’ve lived in this state since 1976 an d I have yet to see a road built or refurbished that wasn’t overloaded the day it was opened. Ok,  I’ll admit we have seen a huge influx of residents but newcomers are the ones usually getting the higher paid wages so the tax base should be going up dramatically.   But WA state is fixing the traffic problems by building a multi-billion dollar North/South light rail system that nobody rides.    It is pretty obvious they are going to let traffic get so bad that people will finally give up and ride the light rail.   But those that come in from the East such as those in the Monroe area are SOL.    With house prices and cost of living going so crazy high here it won’t be long and we will have a net loss in population.  The City Governments have so alienated the population many want to leave and from what I am picking up on the street is that many Western WA and Western OR residents are looking East at states like Idaho and Montana. Several Eastern Oregon counties are trying to attach themselves to Idaho and if successful Eastern Washington  counties will do the same. Coastal cities in CA are losing population to states like Texas, AZ and NV. 

 

We winter in AZ and it reminds me so much of when we lived in SO CA in the 60’s and 70’s. They know how to build roads for future needs. Even at commute hours one can get to work driving 30 miles in less than 30 minutes. Yes ,there are exceptions but they are few and far between.   But….  There is a huge problem staring California, NV and AZ right in the face.  The lack of water. They are already restricting water usage and it isn’t even summer yet. That is going to put a real limit on how many people can move to AZ and NV.  That leaves Texas as the place to escape to. . IMHO, the movement of people to the Coastal cities on the West Coast is coming to an end. As a result of idiotic city governments, the defund police movements and Covid 19, people want out.  They want to move out to where we live in the country or further East out of the state. . I get phone calls at least once a week from Relators begging us to put our house on the market. Have active cash buyers they say.   I think it is a bit of BS but we have lived here for 22 years and it has never been like this before. It is at best called CRAZY. We are staying here until we can’t take care of the place any longer. We figure we have about 5 years left. I will be dead inside of a year if I have move back in the city. 

 

I almost bought a Battery powered chain saw a couple years ago but I bought a Smaller/Lighter Stihl which is 2 cycle and I really like it. It has started easily and I’ve worked its butt off.   More than I even envisioned when I bought it.  I had a bigger Stihl which I had owned since 1976 but is finally gave up  a couple years ago.  Coil went bad and they are made out of unobtanium. Darn thing only gave me 40 plus years of service.  They don’t make things like they used to. 

  

Dean VP

Snohomish, WA 98290

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."

..Winston Churchill...

 

From: AT  <mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com> On Behalf Of Kenneth Gene Waugh
Sent: Saturday, June 5, 2021 6:13 PM
To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group  <mailto:at at lists.antique-tractor.com> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Subject: Re: [AT] Lawn mower carburetors are a piece of cake..... Wrong

 

Dean, THANK YOU!! I have never gotten as involved as most on this list, and my experience with carburetors is pretty dismal. Not total failure, but dismal! And my 2 cycle experience is really, really dismal! Over the past couple years I have gotten rid of ALL 2 cycle equipment! :-)!! I have replaced trimmer, blower and a couple other functions with EGO battery powered equipment. Been very pleased.

Dean, I have a stepson who lives with his wife on 126th St SE there in Snohomish---nice area!

 

Gene Waugh

Elgin, IL

 

On Sat, Jun 5, 2021 at 7:38 PM Dean VP <deanvp at att.net <mailto:deanvp at att.net> > wrote:

You ATIS members need a good laugh once in a while.  This should help provide that at my expense. ,

One of my Grandsons just purchased his first house which has a small grass lawn with it.  Small enough lawn a self-propelled 20 - 22" push mower would be just fine.  Since he is moving out of an apartment he would need to buy a mower.   I volunteered to give him one of mine that I have out in the barn that haven't been run for a while. Don't even remember now when or where I got this one, it was probably cheap at some garage sale or auction and is a Toro Model 20216.  Probably 20" to 22" (haven't measured) deck with a 4HP Briggs motor and it can be self-propelled with 3 forward gears .Everything worked fine on it when I used it last probably several years ago (ran when parked)  and my only two complaints about it were the 4HP made it underpowered and the aluminum deck was pretty brittle  and has been welded once. I have been blessed with a wealth of rocks on  my yard.   I noticed the deck now has a couple more cracks but the mower is useable as is all I have to do is get it running. 

I cleaned everything up, cleaned the spark plug, changed oil and put in new gas.  I don't have a manual for the mower and the only way I could figure out how to get the old oil out was to either pump it out or lay it on its side and drain it out the fill tube. . Very dumb and very owner unfriendly. . Anyway tried to start it.    Not even a pop. Choke full on.   Tried ether. Yep, I could get it to run for a second or two but obviously not getting gas to the cylinder. Check gas line, check bowl, yep getting gas to the carburetor.  Sum Ting Wong with the carburetor.

Now mistakenly I think I know what I'm doing relative to carburetors with several successful Antique Tractor and Garden Tractor carburetor rebuilds  under my belt but it has been a long time since I have worked on a Lawn Mower Carburetor.   But needing to be humbled a bit I guess I have forgotten a key detail about Briggs carburetor's. I pulled the carb, removed the bowl and found a sandy white substance (dirt?) in the bowl and also in the needle and seat well.  Not typical of what I have seen in carbs in the past. But continue to disassemble removing the float and needle. Don't see a removable seat and disassemble the rest of the carb.  Run small wires through any opening I can find and make sure they are clean and blow air through any passage I can find.  One thing that happened worried me. I had the air hose nozzle on the gas intake pipe and a little pop occurred and something hit me in the face. My observation was that it had come out of the bottom where the needle seats..   Hmmmm .............must have been plugged right there. 😊  Couldn't find what came out. I bet the carburetor will work now.  Operator now in full idiot mode!😊 

Moving on, soaked the carburetor in Pine Sol overnight and this morning cleaned it with fresh water.  Carburetor looks like new.  Man.... I am really good.     Hmm, the bowl gasket has expanded in diameter in the pine sol. That is not good. But start reassembling the carburetor and put the float and needle in place  and it is obvious the needle is dropping too far down and not seating properly.   Aha, that is what must have blown out and hit me in the face. Hummmmm  how do you blow out a brass seat?  Now I'm confused.  Get on the internet and watch a video of an overhaul of this type of lawn mower carburetor.  Gets to the part about removing the needle and seat. " An easy way to get the little rubber needle seat out is to blow air into the gas inlet of the carburetor"    Been there, done that.   Yep, I can completely verify that works very well but I didn't know it when I did it. @#$%^&*()   Now I sure as hell know what hit me in  the face. I can't find that little sucker.  So... $9 gets me a carburetor overhaul kit over night from Amazon.   Needed a new bowl gasket too.  Isn't it amazing how the problem and solution can hit you right in the face???

In searching for the right carburetor kit  I noticed I could buy a whole new carburetor for $10.49. But I have been down that road before and I was not pleased with what I received. So I'm staying with the OEM Carburetor.  One day delivery on the parts.

BTW, I'm not very sure this mower is even worth the $9 carburetor repair kit. But....  I am going to  beat this sucker into submission.  This is the way us old folks turn one hour jobs into a full day's entertainment.


Dean V
Snohomish, WA 98290
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."
..Winston Churchill...


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-- 

Gene

Kenneth Gene Waugh

Elgin, Illinois

 

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Francis Robinson
aka "farmer"
Central Indiana USA
robinson46176 at gmail.com <mailto:robinson46176 at gmail.com> 









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