[AT] Supposedly why our old tractors are not metric and a fairly simple tutorial
Cecil Bearden
crbearden at copper.net
Tue Feb 25 16:21:23 PST 2020
I figured out he meant rent one, but there is not one in Oklahoma for
rent. The closest thing is made by Zircon and has a depth in concrete
of 4-3/4 inches and is within 1/2 inch of location..... Oklahoma is a
third world country when it comes to technology.
Cecil
On 2/25/2020 3:54 PM, Stephen Offiler wrote:
> I think he means rent one.
>
> SO
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2020 at 4:51 PM <bradloomis at charter.net
> <mailto:bradloomis at charter.net>> wrote:
>
> Nice, but $700 US. Ouch.
>
> *From:* AT <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
> <mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com>> *On Behalf Of
> *Thomas Martin
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 25, 2020 1:41 PM
> *To:* Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group
> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com <mailto:at at lists.antique-tractor.com>>
> *Subject:* Re: [AT] Supposedly why our old tractors are not metric
> and a fairly simple tutorial
>
> Surely your local hire company would have one of these or similar?
>
> https://www.bosch-pt.co.nz/nz/en/products/d-tect-150-sv-wallscanner-0601010008
>
> Tom
>
> On 26 February 2020 at 10:31 Cecil Bearden
> <crbearden at copper.net <mailto:crbearden at copper.net>> wrote:
>
> I have thought about that, and have an old and a newer 4 post
> lift just not installed. When you work on both trucks and
> tractors, the lift can get in the way. I would like to
> install the 4 post 30K lift, but the floor has water pipes for
> heat under the slab. We don't know where they are, and the
> posts have to have a pier under them. The floor has 8" piers
> under the slab, cannot remember where they are. I thought of
> fastening 4' x 4' plates 1in thick to the floor and then
> fasten the posts to them. The floor is reinforced with
> reinforcing steel. I need to find the reinforcing in the
> floor and try to miss the bars with the plate anchors.
> Cecil
>
> On 2/25/2020 2:14 PM, Thomas Martin wrote:
>
> Surely a two poster would be a better bet?
>
> Tom
>
> On 26 February 2020 at 08:29 Cecil Bearden
> <crbearden at copper.net> <mailto:crbearden at copper.net>
> wrote:
>
> Since I have a spinal problem and now one worn out
> stiff knee, getting up and down under anything is a
> problem. Once I get down I have to either make do
> with what I have or haul all 300 lbs of myself up and
> get what I need then when I get within a foot of the
> floor, I usually just try to fall on something
> soft!!!!!! I have seriously been looking at this
> creeper made for aircraft. https://ezcreeper.com/ I
> just wish it was available with an electric pump. I
> have been looking for a drill powered hydraulic pump
> to adapt to this creeper.
> Cecil
>
> On 2/25/2020 12:56 PM, Ron Cook wrote:
>
> Which is what I do. And danged if I still don't
> have the right one!
>
> Ron Cook, Salix, IA
>
> On 2/25/2020 12:47 PM, Stephen Offiler wrote:
>
> As a matter of fact I turn 58 today, and I
> maintain my physical fitness to the best of my
> ability, so you're probably right in that
> regard. But sorry, I reject the notion that
> bringing the wrong wrench is a
> blood-pressure-raising event, and I stand fast
> by my comment. This simply isn't an argument
> against the metric system. Seriously, just
> bring several wrenches...
>
> SO
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2020 at 1:28 PM <
> deanvp at att.net <mailto:deanvp at att.net>> wrote:
>
> Steve,
>
> You may not have reached the age where
> getting down and under a vehicle and then
> getting back up is a major effort. Having
> the wrong wrench when I get under there is
> not a happy event. Should I give up DIY
> wrenching? Not a chance as long as my
> body is still warm. If I didn’t keep
> trying to do this stuff I would have been
> 6’ under a long time ago,
>
> Dean VP
>
> Apache Junction, AZ
>
> *From:* AT
> <at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
> <mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com>>
> *On Behalf Of *Stephen Offiler
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 25, 2020 8:18 AM
> *To:* Antique Tractor Email Discussion
> Group <at at lists.antique-tractor.com
> <mailto:at at lists.antique-tractor.com>>
> *Subject:* Re: [AT] Supposedly why our old
> tractors are not metric and a fairly
> simple tutorial
>
> You might want to re-think the whole DIY
> wrenching thing if that's all it takes to
> get your blood pressure up.
>
> SO
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2020 at 10:13 AM
> ustonThomas Mehrkam
> <tmehrkam at sbcglobal.net
> <mailto:tmehrkam at sbcglobal.net>> wrote:
>
> It was a evil plot to sell us another
> set of tools. The proof is I still
> need two sets to service my modern pickup.
>
> It sells a lot of blood pressure meds.
> Especially when I crawl under the darn
> thing only to find that one d at m bolt
> is metric causing a cussing wrench
> throwing fit as I crawl back out to
> get that evil metric wrench.
>
> Sent from AT&T Yahoo Mail on Android
> <https://go.onelink.me/107872968?pid=InProduct&c=Global_Internal_YGrowth_AndroidEmailSig__AndroidUsers&af_wl=ym&af_sub1=Internal&af_sub2=Global_YGrowth&af_sub3=EmailSignature>
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2020 at 3:40 AM,
> Thomas Martin
>
> <tmartin at xtra.co.nz
> <mailto:tmartin at xtra.co.nz>> wrote:
>
>
> > On 25 February 2020 at 17:12
> John Hall <jtchall at nc.rr.com
> <mailto:jtchall at nc.rr.com>> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Don't know why they couldn't
> change pipe threads, after all the
> rest of
> > the planet uses 60 deg, not 55
> for the British threads. Can't
> really see
> > how it is simpler than what we
> use. I mean how exactly do the
> Japanese
> > explain such? Never seen a
> German print in inches either for
> that
> > matter. If metric is so much
> better, then go all in I say.
>
> Well the rest of the world for a
> long time was British or used
> British technology
> before Sellars came along with his
> 60º thread form in the US. The US
> wasn't a great exporter
> at the time, focusing more on
> internal expansion & self-sufficiency
> >
> > You missed the part about
> leaving out the bastard pipe
> threads, didn't
> > you? We did so much hydraulic
> work at one point that all I
> stocked was
> > NPTF, it works for NPT. As you
> know, NPT covers the vast majority,
> > while NPTF will cover the
> majority of whats left. The scraps
> can be left
> > to those who specialize in oddities.
> >
> > Never needed an IH bearing that
> I couldn't source from wherever. The
> > only roller bearing I ever
> needed that was manufacture
> specific was the
> > plunger bearing on a New Holland
> baler. Motion industries finally was
> > able to cross it, but I couldn't
> find it any where else, not even
> > aftermarket ag parts. And the
> bearing housing had to come from New
> > Holland, nothing even close.
> That set up cost me close to $300
> >
> I think there is a slight time
> frame difference in our work
> experience,
> My experience with Cat, IH, & AC
> was in the 60s & 70 and included
> machinery built in the 50s. Cat &
> IH did insist on bearings that were
> only Cat & IH inclusive, whereas
> AC crawlers that used more Timken
> style
> bearings, could be sourced from
> any bearing supply co. Five times
> cheaper
> than Cat Or IH equivalents.
> An interesting aside was that,
> rarely was there a need for
> machining with
> AC, Cat or, IH as regards remedial
> repair of parts. Good designs
> leave little
> room for improvement.
>
> > We have an entire section of
> bastard taps at work, it has just
> as many
> > oddball metrics as it does
> english. It all depends on the
> industries you
> > support as to what is in your
> tool crib.
> >
> Around here, its fruit and meat
> processing.
> At the local Heinz cannery, all
> the peach & pear lines were
> American sourced,
> and the makers delighted in shaft
> sizes like 1-7/16", 1-9/16" & 1-15/16"
> with ODs to match. Only source was
> the manufacturer.
> Another delight was the spaghetti
> extruder, it had a 50hp motor driving
> the extruder through reduction
> gears, every every shaft was a
> nominal size +
> a 1/16" Guess where the bearings
> had to come from. It had one bad
> design
> fault in that the heaviest
> reduction had no hunting teeth,
> and it had some
> very bad wear patterns revealed on
> dismantling, had a blank forged in
> Australia,
> it was about 600mm with a 152mm
> face. :-)
> >
> > I've found that engineers don't
> always make stuff weird so you
> have to
> > buy from them, its often so you
> don't make a substitution that
> > compromises the design. But
> there are some that need a plate
> glass
> > stomach.....
> "Plate glass stomach"?
> Don't know that saying, although I
> have modified modified maker's efforts
> for the better, when their designs
> were found wanting. Flattering
> when they
> come up with the same improvement...
>
> Tom
> >
> > John
> >
> > On 2/24/2020 10:41 PM, Thomas
> Martin wrote:
> > >> On 25 February 2020 at 15:17
> John Hall <jtchall at nc.rr.com
> <mailto:jtchall at nc.rr.com>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Fun fact. Did you know metric
> pipe threads are actually in
> inches? They
> > >> are actually 55 deg
> threadform (British Whitworth) but
> the pitch is in
> > >> metric. And the real fun part
> is that the rest of the planet
> can't even
> > >> decide how to spec them on
> drawing/print/blueprint. Different
> countries
> > >> have different designations
> for the same thing. Off the top of
> my head,
> > >> I think there are a combined
> 7 different ways of designating
> metric pipe
> > >> threads (taper and straight),
> as opposed to just 2. Now we won't
> split
> > >> hairs with short projection,
> dryseal or other specialty
> threads--lets
> > >> stick to 99.999% of pipe threads.
> > >>
> > >> FWIW, I have 30 years in a
> machine shop and have continually
> used both
> > >> english and metric without an
> issue. Its the rest of the planet that
> > >> makes a big ordeal out of it,
> we just grab a print and go with it.
> > >> English, German,
> Japanese--its all the same--until
> we have to use
> > >> Translate Google to figure
> out the notes.
> > >>
> > >> One more fun fact. Next time
> you need some roller bearings for
> your old
> > >> tractor and start measuring
> them only to find they aren't exactly
> > >> english, convert them to
> metric--you might ought to sit
> down first.
> > >>
> > >> I won't even get into
> European conduit threads--I've
> only had to do them
> > >> twice.
> > >>
> > >> John Hall
> > >>
> > > Well, John
> > > Europe did adopt BSP (British
> Standard Pipe) threads
> > > back in the 19th century,
> difficult to change horses now.
> > > Quite a simple setup compared
> to the American system!
> > > Did you know that the US has
> 11 diffent derivatives of
> > > National Pipe threads?
> > > As for 11-1/2 tpi NPT, I bet
> many a lathe manufacturer
> > > swore when Norton invented the
> quick change gearbox for
> > > lathes and provision had to be
> made for that.
> > > In fact would say I have cut
> more peculiar threads of US
> > > origin that elsewhere.
> > > That goes for bearings also.
> Both Caterpillar and IH used to
> > > get bearings, especially
> taper-roller, ground to their
> > > specific sizes, so that only
> they could supply, at a cost
> > > 5 to 10 times the cost of a
> standard size! Extortionate!
> > > Competition finally forced
> them into standardization in the
> finish.
> > > FMC was another who engaged in
> the practice in another field.
> > >
> > > Tom
> > >
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