[AT] Kubota M5700 noise

Dave Maynard dave at themaplehillfarm.com
Tue Aug 11 11:14:00 PDT 2020 

Does anyone know of some tractor scrapyard? Having a hard time finding an
exhaust manifold for this Kubota M5700. It seems the only one they used
this engine and they dont use it anymore. I appreciate any help you can
give me

Dave Maynard

On Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 4:51 PM Dave Maynard <dave at themaplehillfarm.com>
wrote:

> I just wish we found it before splitting the tractor and sending things to
> the engine shop and buying all the rebuild parts. The real truth wont be
> known until it's back together and fired up.
>
> Dave
>
> On Mon, Aug 10, 2020, 2:24 PM Spencer Yost <spencer at rdfarms.com> wrote:
>
>> Picture came through fine. Thanks for following up and letting us know
>> the final resolution. It’s always nice to know how things turn out.
>>
>> Glad it was a much easier fix than many of the alternatives!
>>
>> Spencer
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Aug 8, 2020, at 8:12 PM, Mike Maynard <mmaynard at rochester.rr.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> 
>> Here is the YouTube link of the video -
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMxOofbbJOA
>>
>> guess I should have supplied it earlier!
>>
>> 99% sure the source of the noise has been located - see attached picture
>> (if the list allows them....  been many years since I participated much)
>>
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 6:26 AM Stephen Offiler <soffiler at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Me neither.  Error:
>>> Access to r3---sn-vgqsrnek.googlevideo.com was denied You don't have
>>> authorization to view this page.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 12:00 AM Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Won't load for me Dave.
>>>>
>>>> Mike M
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 4/18/2020 4:52 PM, Dave Maynard wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Will do Mike. I appreciate all the help and interest in helping me find
>>>> a solution to this problem. Many very experienced and knowledgeable people
>>>> on here and I certainly enjoy reading everything and many times learning
>>>> things. We haven't gotten very much further with this due to some other
>>>> pressing things, but will. New injectors made no difference at all. Just
>>>> today however, the guys are working on  a four cylinder version of this
>>>> Kubota  engine and sent me the attached video clip. Sounds very similar to
>>>> my noise. Weak valve spring in the head, see what you all think. If you
>>>> click on this, at the bottom it says "go to link" and it will get you
>>>> there. Sorry, haven't been on a computer since I retired and just got my
>>>> laptop back from my son who fixed it, so figuring how to get this texted
>>>> video to attach to the email was a chore and not sure if this was the way,
>>>> but it worked! Lol
>>>>
>>>> Dave Maynard
>>>> The Maple Hill Farm
>>>> Marion, NY
>>>>
>>>> https://r3---sn-vgqsrnek.googlevideo.com/videoplayback?expire=1587249885&ei=vWabXuqQJ-yPir4PnP2b0Ag&ip=74.69.206.141&id=8e77dec671cecdd0&itag=37&source=picasa&begin=0&requiressl=yes&mh=4G&mm=30&mn=sn-vgqsrnek&ms=nxu&mv=u&mvi=2&pl=23&sc=yes&susc=ph&app=fife&mime=video/mp4&cnr=14&dur=6.153&lmt=1587239101906161&mt=1587242304&sparams=expire,ei,ip,id,itag,source,requiressl,susc,app,mime,cnr,dur,lmt&sig=AJpPlLswRQIhAMem1LR4HFWc9FRrnjAuULSl_8Hct2cwBUMJvVjpSp08AiAKJ78mrFHMS8CdrtzfOAcROoIhrd9w_-3bWHzQSXHX_A==&lsparams=mh,mm,mn,ms,mv,mvi,pl,sc&lsig=ALrAebAwRAIgOvaXXGqqyzob2OV9veVkI84nmv2LSX6Pa1YivEL5jbMCIFnKOojXR0kxcC_cjLU_y9tvAbOImRgjUxXal3_let-J
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Apr 18, 2020 at 1:16 PM Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Keep us updated Dave, this has been an interesting and informative
>>>>> thread.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike M
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 4/8/2020 12:57 PM, Dave Maynard wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> By the way, not even sure if this has the wrong rod, just been
>>>>> guessing until we can get it in and apart. I wonder though if there could
>>>>> be residual fuel from an unfinished burn caused by yet unknown reason.
>>>>> Maybe carbon buildup in pre combustion chamber which may cause higher
>>>>> compression or poor atomization. Maybe Cecil's thought of loose or cracked
>>>>> pre combustion chamber. Unseen crack in the head, causing an improper
>>>>> mixture, or maybe even a piston pin bearing we missed. Still dont know how
>>>>> soon we can get it inside and apart, as we need to get a place ready. Don't
>>>>> want it apart outside, and this time it could be apart a little longer than
>>>>> the others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave M.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2020, 12:46 PM Dave Maynard <dave at themaplehillfarm.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The tractor in NY you are referring to IS this tractor. That is a
>>>>>> post my son Mike made back when we first got it. You may recognize him on
>>>>>> here as Mangus.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dave M
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2020, 11:58 AM ustonThomas Mehrkam <
>>>>>> tmehrkam at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A Google search for  kubota M5700 engine noise  turns up a thread
>>>>>>> on tractorbytenet about a tractor in new york with exactly the same
>>>>>>> problem.  Knock piston 5.  You might follow this thread to see if there was
>>>>>>> a solution
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> M5700 'Knock' and other questions
>>>>>>> <https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kubota-owning-operating/413832-m5700-knock-other-questions.html>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> M5700 'Knock' and other questions
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My father picked up a M5700 this weekend. Overall its in nice shape,
>>>>>>> but we have a couple things we are trying t...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kubota-owning-operating/413832-m5700-knock-other-questions.html>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 8, 2020, 9:36:42 AM CDT, Cecil Bearden <
>>>>>>> crbearden at copper.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think the possibility of leftover fuel on the piston might be the
>>>>>>> problem.  Steve O may have figured it out.  It has been many years since I
>>>>>>> did a compression analysis.  Old Dog forgets older tricks thing!!!
>>>>>>> Maybe you can get an application list for the rod number??
>>>>>>> Cecil
>>>>>>> On 4/8/2020 9:11 AM, Dave Maynard wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> By reducing compression, would ignition take place at the proper
>>>>>>> time? Would combustion be complete, or would there be leftover fuel that
>>>>>>> could change things on next compression stroke, and maybe pre ignite
>>>>>>> causing the knock?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 8, 2020, 5:18 AM Stephen Offiler <soffiler at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I just worked out some math.  That engine is 87mm bore x 92mm
>>>>>>> stroke.  23:1 compression.  Swept volume is .547 liter, giving combustion
>>>>>>> chamber volume of .0238 liter.  Now, what-if the con rod was 1mm too
>>>>>>> short?  That adds .0059 liter to the combustion chamber, now .0297 liter,
>>>>>>> which drops compression down to 18.4:1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 7:02 PM Doug Tallman <dtallman at accnorwalk.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The rod being too short can't change injector timing or cause
>>>>>>> pre-ignition. It would just mean less compression because the piston
>>>>>>> wouldn't come up as far.  Doug T
>>>>>>> On 4/6/2020 6:24 PM, Dave Maynard wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I know the piston is correct as we replaced it. But James makes a
>>>>>>> good point to ponder, if the rod is too short, it may change injector
>>>>>>> timing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 6, 2020, 6:03 PM Bo Hinch <bohinch at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Or the wrong Piston ( too short or tall ) .
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 6, 2020 at 12:40 PM Dave Maynard <
>>>>>>> dave at themaplehillfarm.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Actually, did not check length of connecting rod and its clearance
>>>>>>> from head at TDC. But it's not traveling to close to the head as there
>>>>>>> would be damage showing. Just have this new concern about the wrong rod
>>>>>>> being put in by mistake, but that would have been short, not long.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 6, 2020, 1:01 PM Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When you had it apart, did you check all the piston,ring and bearing
>>>>>>> clearances?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mike M
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 4/6/2020 11:35 AM, Dave Maynard wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No sleeves in this engine. Someone had this engine apart before and
>>>>>>> #5 had a new piston and rod and bearings. The seller said it was his
>>>>>>> father's tractor since new and never been apart....he lied! There was more
>>>>>>> RTV on oil pan than you could imagine and obviously that piston and rod and
>>>>>>> bearings had been replaced and I thought they had been chasing the noise.
>>>>>>> Unless there was some other reason, but dont know.
>>>>>>>      My friend and mechanic help has a Jacobson mower he's is
>>>>>>> rebuilding that has a 4 cylinder version of this motor that appears
>>>>>>> identical except the number of cyl's. He found the rod to be the same
>>>>>>> except it a tweak shorter by an almost immeasurable amount, maybe .005 or
>>>>>>> .010. Part number is almost the same except last digit and now I'm
>>>>>>> wondering if that could be someone's mistake. Would shorter rod cause
>>>>>>> preignition? By the way, there is no part number on the rods so they would
>>>>>>> have to be accurately measured.
>>>>>>>      It's going to be a bit before I can get this back apart again,
>>>>>>> but hoping to have this fixed in time to plow.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 6, 2020, 9:08 AM Cecil Bearden <crbearden at copper.net>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That was one of my thoughts, but my experience has been that the
>>>>>>> liner movement was a double "thud" once on down stroke and once on
>>>>>>> upstroke.
>>>>>>> Cecil
>>>>>>> On 4/6/2020 1:12 AM, k7jdj at aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cylinder liner loose.  Don't know if this engine even has cylinder
>>>>>>> liners if it does and that liner is moving you would get click. Did you
>>>>>>> look carefully at the head when you had it off and look for any sign of
>>>>>>> head distress?
>>>>>>> I would do a compression check as well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gary
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Renton, WA.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Roger Moffat <rogerkiwi at gmail.com> <rogerkiwi at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> To: Antique Tractor Email Discussion Group
>>>>>>> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>>>>>>> Sent: Sun, Apr 5, 2020 7:43 pm
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Kubota M5700 noise
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Apr 5, 2020, at 9:59 PM, Dave Maynard <dave at themaplehillfarm.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Have cracked injector lines one at a time, and it gets quieter on #5
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But only on #5?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When you crack the others the engine misses, but the noise remains?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I wonder if something about cylinder 5 is somehow different so that
>>>>>>> the compression is higher, and so it’s igniting (pre-igniting) too much
>>>>>>> before top dead centre in just that cylinder?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eg #5 piston slightly higher than the other 4?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Roger
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>> <2020-08-08.jpg>
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