[AT] Farm flooding update California - new info

Tue Feb 7 17:41:44 PST 2017

New laws happen when idiots do stupid things.  There's a LOT of idiots out
there.  Eventually it leads to BIG government.   Now what does this have to
do with tractors?

SO

On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 7:17 PM, Dave <rotigel at me.com> wrote:

> Hi Cecil,
>         You must remember that BIG government is your friend. The judgment
> of those in charge of BIG government is MUCH better than yours, or all of
> us together for that matter. You must never question the judgement of BIG
> government because it is YOUR FRIEND and will ALWAYS protect you—even from
> yourself!
>         Dave
>
> > On Feb 7, 2017, at 5:34 PM, charlie hill <charliehill at embarqmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Cecil, after that particular hurricane there were stacks beside the road
> > in front of every flooded house.  I mean dump truck size stacks with
> items
> > FEMA had demanded be thrown away.  I have a friend who installs and
> repairs
> > TV's and Satellite systems.  He was down there on a service call and saw
> a
> > nearly new JD riding lawn tractor in one of the piles.  He asked the
> owner
> > and was told FEMA made him throw it out.  He told the guy how crazy that
> was
> > and said he would have kept it somehow.   The guy said, "I'm just doing
> what
> > they told me I had to do. Put it in the pile and wait for the clean up
> crew
> > to haul it off.
> > If you want it take it, I didn't see anything."  My friend loaded it up,
> > brought it home
> > and in a few hours had it running good as new.  That's just one small
> > example.
> >
> > Charlie
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Cecil Bearden
> > Sent: Monday, February 06, 2017 7:53 PM
> > To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> > Subject: Re: [AT] Farm flooding update California - new info
> >
> > Charlie:
> >
> > I have been the chairman of a local floodplain board in OK since 82 or
> > 83.  I once was cited as being the longest serving floodplain board
> > chairman and member in the US....     Don't know if that is official or
> > not....   However, a few years back maybe 20 now, FEMA got all high and
> > mighty and decided that everybody had to come up to their standards.  I
> > have not heard of throwing everything away here after a flood, but when
> > the Feds get involved, they think that everyone has insurance and it
> > covers 100%.  After the 1995 bombing of the OKC Federal building, a
> > restoration company was brought in to do what the employees should have
> > been doing.  These guys used rented trucks and homeless mission part
> > time workers.  ( same as all disasters)  They were advised by the OK
> > risk management director to trash all chairs and wall sections ( I call
> > them Lego style ) that had any fabric, due to the risk of glass being
> > embedded in the fabric.    The furniture went into a semi van.  I
> > followed it to a local used office furniture dealer.  They ran a shop
> > vac over everything and sold it.  The dealer paid cash to the
> > driver............
> >
> > During these disasters, there always some shady deals, and the Feds are
> > in the middle.........  The guy who was at the center of this was later
> > a City manager where over $200K disappeared.  They never proved
> > anything, but he just kept showing up in government offices.....  The
> > old saying "follow the money"  applies in all disasters...
> >
> > Cecil in OKla
> >
> > On 2/6/2017 1:31 PM, charlie hill wrote:
> >> Good luck with that.  I hope you are correct.  From a government
> >> perspective, NC is trying hard to be California east with regulations.
> >> I can tell you for sure, if that happened here the state, county and
> >> probably federal government would be in here telling us what we
> >> can and cannot fix. Here is an example.  This area of NC is prone to
> >> hurricane tidal flooding. That is different from the river flooding
> >> we talked about earlier. Both are caused by hurricanes but the tidal
> >> flooding
> >> is quick and short.  Down nearer the coast than I am there are many
> houses
> >> owned by very poor people that have been flooded dozens of times over
> the
> >> years. In the past the folks got some clorox and poured it around in the
> >> house,
> >> ripped up any carpets, ripped out wet sheetrock, pulled up a few floor
> >> boards
> >> to let everything drain and waited for it to dry.  Then they made
> repairs
> >> as
> >> they
> >> could afford and went on with life.  Then about 20 years ago we had a
> >> hurricane
> >> that flooded a lot of those houses.  FEMA showed up with the county
> >> building
> >> inspectors
> >> in tow.  The proceeded to condemn houses and require that they be
> brought
> >> up
> >> to code
> >> before they could be reoccupied.  The owners complained that they
> couldn't
> >> afford that.
> >> The government said they could borrow the money from the Small Business
> >> Adm.
> >> The people
> >> said we can't make the payments.  The government said too bad.  Now
> those
> >> houses sit
> >> abandoned and the folks, mostly older and poor, have moved on or moved
> in
> >> with family.
> >> Don't get the idea that private property rights mean anything.
> >>
> >> Look to make my point because I know you are reading this as bad as it
> >> was.
> >> They made people
> >> throw away bicycles, children's plastic swings, slides and big wheel
> >> tricycles, riding lawn mowers,
> >> etc.  because they had been touched by flood water and might be
> >> contaminated!  If water lines
> >> or wiring in or under the floor of a house were touched by the flood
> water
> >> it had to be ripped out.
> >> If the flooding went above the receptacle boxes in the walls ALL of the
> >> wiring had to be ripped out back
> >> to the panel box.
> >>
> >> Charlie
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Grant Brians
> >> Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2017 3:32 PM
> >> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> >> Subject: Re: [AT] Farm flooding update California - new info
> >>
> >> California is an interesting mix of getting things done efficiently and
> >> not at all. Most of the rest of the country thinks we must be lazy with
> >> beaches, skiing and Hollywood, but the reality is that California has
> >> the highest average work week in the country, the highest productivity
> >> and the largest economy. At the same time we do have lazy people like
> >> every place and much of the state is too expensive because too many
> >> people want to live in those areas.
> >>       In this case, I think I can prove that lack of maintenance of the
> >> creek bed and levees caused the damage and so not even enter the zone of
> >> wetland or not. This land does seasonally flood but except in this
> >> damage situation, it has never been covered for more than three days at
> >> a time and the water flows off, no ponds. It is literally a flood PLAIN.
> >> So the issue will be fixing the situation not proving it is ok to do so.
> >>                  Grant Brians
> >> On 2/5/2017 11:54 AM, charlie hill wrote:
> >>> Grant, if a flood washed out an area such as you described in my area
> of
> >>> the world I really doubt that you or the land owner would be allowed to
> >>> fix it.  They would call it an act of God and proclaim it a wetland.
> The
> >>> state
> >>> would claim ownership or at least control of it and that would be the
> end
> >>> of
> >>> it.
> >>>
> >>> Charlie
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: Grant Brians
> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2017 9:08 AM
> >>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> >>> Subject: Re: [AT] Farm flooding update California - new info
> >>>
> >>> Dave, government is only peripherally involved in the cause of the
> >>> damage. Because stream clearance has been prohibited without a lengthy
> >>> and expensive process of approval and the flood control district never
> >>> had taxing authority and no one wanted to run for a position it went
> >>> defunct. It exists on paper but not in fact. As a result I was working
> >>> with the county's flood agency before these floods to help get the
> >>> needed functions operational under their legal purview, but nothing
> >>> concrete had been done yet in the last 9 months I was pushing....
> >>>        No, this is not on land I own either, I just lease it. This
> makes
> >>> things more complicated yet. In short, I will be continuing to see if
> it
> >>> is possible to recover from the damage there or not. So in regards to
> >>> act of God or not it depends on who wants it to be or not be one. If it
> >>> were not so serious for me I would be laughing because it is truly
> funny
> >>> how things can get messed up when the community does not come together
> >>> to resolve issues.
> >>>                 Grant Brians
> >>> On 2/4/2017 2:51 PM, Dave wrote:
> >>>> I can understand what you describe, Mike and agree that IF the
> >>>> government
> >>>> was responsible for Grant’s situation then they should be held
> >>>> accountable. But in Grant’s case it sounded like an act of God and I
> was
> >>>> wondering if I had missed something. Thanks!
> >>>> Dave
> >>>>
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