[AT] Need help with newer compact tractor

Mike M meulenms at gmx.com
Mon May 23 09:20:27 PDT 2016


That started with the 2011 model line up as far as I know. I'll double 
check my manual though. Should have just stuck with the M1 synthetic, I 
plan to drive this truck until it's only good for parts.

Mike M



On 5/23/2016 9:48 AM, Stephen Offiler wrote:
> Mike, does that 6.2 require Dexos oil?
>
> SO
>
> On Sun, May 22, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>
>> Funny you should say that Cecil, my daily driver is a 2010 Chevy 1500
>> 6.2 gasser. I usually run 5/30 Mobil 1 Synthetic  in it and have since
>> it was new to me with 45,000 miles on it. It now has 88,000 miles on it
>> and needed the oil changed. I do it myself because everything is really
>> easy to get to . This time however I went with Pennzoil 5/30 regular
>> oil, because it was on sale. I had knee surgery on Monday, so my wife
>> has had to drive me around. Now when it's cold and I get in the
>> passenger side I hear what appears to be a rod knock or piston slap, not
>> bad, but enough that I noticed. I'm just wondering if it's always been
>> there, and I've never heard it because I was in the cab when I started
>> it, or if it's new because of the oil. I've never had any problem with
>> Pennzoil in fact my small engines love the stuff.
>>
>> Mike M
>>
>>
>> On 5/22/2016 7:09 PM, Cecil Bearden wrote:
>>> The oil that I checked on through the API website was classified as
>>> being from new oil.  The re-run is listed as from recycled oil.  Warren
>>> now cans way too much oil to be only a re-refiner.   I think they bottle
>>> nearly 75% of the retail oil.  That said, I put Valvoline Nextgen 10w-30
>>> in my replacement engine in my f-150 to flush out whatever was in there,
>>> and 3000 miles later it had to go to the shop for a noise we thought was
>>> the A/C clutch and I had the guy change the oil while it was there
>>> because the filter is nearly impossible to get to. I had my own oil in
>>> the back and he put in some O'reilly parts house oil 5w-30 and it
>>> knocked every time I started it.   I had to add a qt of Lucas oil to
>>> stop the knock.    It was at the level mark after 2000 miles..  I
>>> replaced it with some more Nextgen and it does not use nor leak oil
>>> after another 4000 miles of some high speed driving.   It needs changing
>>> now and is still at the full mark....   I bought about 15 5qt jugs of
>>> that oil at O'reilly auto parts for $3 a jug.  I was going to use it for
>>> cheap hyd fluid etc, but it turned out to be ok for that truck so I just
>>> keep it for that one...
>>>
>>> Cecil in OKla
>>>
>>>
>>> On 5/22/2016 1:19 PM, charlie hill wrote:
>>>> Cecil,  Warren Petroleum is based in Dunn, North Carolina (or were
>> anyway).
>>>> About 30 years ago when they were a much smaller company
>>>> I had the transmission fluid changed in a Chevy pickup. When I
>>>> went to pick the truck up he was just finishing and I saw the empty
>>>> oil jugs on the bench.  They were the wrong oil.  I forget which one
>>>> but not Dexron.  I got on the guy and he swore there was no difference.
>>>> I knew he was wrong, or lying, and took the truck to another shop and
>>>> had the fluid changed again. But, just to prove to myself that I was
>> right
>>>> I called Warren Oil.  I told you all of that to tell you this.
>>>>
>>>> When I called they actually put Mr. Warren on the phone.  I've never
>> been
>>>> more
>>>> impressed by someone I called on the phone.  He took the time to tell
>> me in
>>>> great detail all about the different grades of ATF and went on to tell
>> me
>>>> about his
>>>> company.  They are a re-processor of used oil but unless they have
>> changed
>>>> they
>>>> do so with great care and attention to quality.  I have no problem with
>>>> anything they
>>>> make.
>>>>
>>>> I say they are a re-processor.  That was a long time ago and
>>>> I don't know if they have "graduated" into manufacture from raw
>> materials or
>>>> not.
>>>>
>>>> Charlie
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Cecil Bearden
>>>> Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2016 11:05 PM
>>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Need help with newer compact tractor
>>>>
>>>> Mike:
>>>> I wrestle with the oil price thing every day with so many engines and
>>>> systems I have here, and the lack of funds.   I really don't think that
>>>> one can know enough about the  oil he uses.   I have found  a good motor
>>>> oil ( Ranch Pro bottled by Warren Petroleum ) at the local farm store
>>>> and it has proven to be better than Mystic that I used for many years.
>>>> I really do not trust Mystic products like I once did.  They just do not
>>>> seem to be as good since Total bought them..  I also do use any
>>>> hydraulic oil additive in my Hydrostatic drives.   I was severely
>>>> admonished for it by the hydrostat rebuilder when I talked to them....
>>>>
>>>> Cecil in OKla
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 5/21/2016 6:03 PM, Mike M wrote:
>>>>> Thanks Cecil, I think we're getting to the bottom of this, as soon as
>> my
>>>>> tractor gets home, I'm dropping the fluid and re-filling with Gulf or
>>>>> other higher quality equivalent. What seems expensive now will be cheap
>>>>> once the tractor is out of warranty.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike M
>>>>>
>>>>> On 5/21/2016 5:45 PM, Cecil Bearden wrote:
>>>>>> Mike:
>>>>>> That TSC oil states it is a multi grace or multi Vis.  I found
>> somewhere
>>>>>> it was a 10W30 or 40, If so, and the viscosity improvers are working
>>>>>> correctly or maybe a little more concentrated, then the viscosity
>> could
>>>>>> be too thick at the higher heat.  That 400 SUS is at 100F, while the
>>>>>> others are specified at 100C, another 112 deg F higher......   I had
>>>>>> this same problem with the hydrostat trans in my old JD2750 Swather.
>> I
>>>>>> found out later that the transmission is no longer available nor
>>>>>> repairable.  I had to buy a used one.   The "yellow Bucket" THF I
>> bought
>>>>>> for $19.99 was too thick for the system.  This I was told by the
>> company
>>>>>> rep who used to overhaul these transmissions made by Vickers.  I
>> bought
>>>>>> John Deere  Hytran that replaces the original 303 fluid.  It surely
>> does
>>>>>> sound like your oil is overheating.  You may have a good civil case
>>>>>> against TSC, but chances of getting any results within our lifetime
>> are
>>>>>> slim and none.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>        I had an 1155 V-8 Massey that was a good 130hp tractor, but we
>> had
>>>>>> some leaks in the rear lift cylinders.   My Dad topped off the lift
>> oil
>>>>>> with a barrel of Lathe and Milling machine Way oil I had bought
>> surplus
>>>>>> from a retired machinist for $250.   That oil was over $35/gal in a
>> drum
>>>>>> at the time.  It had an extra stickiness. The entire hydraulic system
>>>>>> turned to crap and it would barely move anything.  It started leaking
>> at
>>>>>> every seal.   My retired father was just too busy to drive 10 miles to
>>>>>> buy a $25 bucket of the cheap stuff that would have worked fine..  It
>>>>>> was my fault according to him because I did not hide the barrel from
>>>>>> him!!!! It was marked in 4 inch letters WAY OIL  !    We ended up
>>>>>> selling the tractor for $2000 to the Mexican market.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I use that yellow bucket stuff in my old dozers and trackhoe.  I have
>>>>>> noticed that if you open the bucket the additives are concentrated at
>>>>>> the bottom.   I try to turn the bucket over for an hour before I pour
>> it
>>>>>> into the tank....
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cecil in OKla
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 5/21/2016 12:42 PM, Mike M wrote:
>>>>>>> Cecil, I think you and Steve might be on to something with the
>>>>>>> viscosity. I wish the Traveller brand oil would give me the
>> Centistokes
>>>>>>> value at 100C and I suspect I could call on Monday and find out.
>> Because
>>>>>>> I've noticed a lack in hydraulic power the service guy adjusted the
>>>>>>> pressure to 2900 lbs, which is over the 2700 Mahindra calls for. He's
>>>>>>> not concerned with that as long as the bypass isn't being tripped. I
>>>>>>> think a change in oil may be in order. If the pump is hunting for
>> oil it
>>>>>>> could be introducing air into the system.  I managed to find the Gulf
>>>>>>> product at a local Autozone store of all places.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mike M
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 5/21/2016 1:07 PM, Cecil Bearden wrote:
>>>>>>>> I looked up some viscosity sites, and 20w motor oil is 68
>> centistokes
>>>>>>>> and 30w is 100 centistokes.   57.5 would be closer to 10W motor oil
>>>>>>>> which is what my old Ingersoll compressor calls for or Dexron ATF or
>>>>>>>> type A transmission fluid. So, I would be thinking that the oil is
>> too
>>>>>>>> thick and the pump is scavenging and giving you a mixture of oil and
>>>>>>>> air
>>>>>>>> which can do weird things to rubber components at high pressure.
>> We
>>>>>>>> also do not know  if this tractor works at 3000 psi or 1500
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cecil in OKla
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 5/21/2016 7:26 AM, Stephen Offiler wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Hi Mike:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> When fluids are REALLY different, they can certainly eat up seals.
>>>>>>>>> But the
>>>>>>>>> magnitude of difference I am talking about is like the difference
>>>>>>>>> between
>>>>>>>>> brake fluid and petroleum-based oils.   For example:    DOT 3, 4,
>> and
>>>>>>>>> 5.1
>>>>>>>>> require EPDM rubber for seals.  But if EPDM sees petroleum, it
>> softens
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> swells... like 25% or more.  Like a frost heave, this swelling is
>>>>>>>>> impossible to contain.  It extrudes itself right out the glands.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> For this to be the case, what came out of that TSC pail would have
>> to
>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>> pretty wrong, is my gut feel.  But someone could have really
>> screwed
>>>>>>>>> up at
>>>>>>>>> the factory I suppose... in that case you would not be the only one
>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>> problems!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Is this the fluid you put in?
>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/traveller-universal-tractor-trans-hydraulic-fluid-5-gal
>>>>>>>>> One thing to note here is the viscosity.  TSC fluid specs 400
>> Saybolt
>>>>>>>>> Universal Seconds (SUS or SSU) at 100F (38C).  An online calculator
>>>>>>>>> tells
>>>>>>>>> me 400 SUS is 86.2 Centistokes.  They SHOULD, but fail, to say
>>>>>>>>> anything
>>>>>>>>> about viscosity index and viscosity at elevated temperature 100C.
>> I
>>>>>>>>> then
>>>>>>>>> looked up the Gulf fluid you mentioned, one that Mahindra
>> specifically
>>>>>>>>> calls for, and find it is 57.5 CentiStokes at 40C.  Whoa.  57.5 is
>>>>>>>>> pretty
>>>>>>>>> different from 86.2.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Not sure what to make of all this and nothing I'm saying here is
>> real
>>>>>>>>> definitive, just trying to shed some more light on the situation.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 2:11 PM, Mike M <meulenms at gmx.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So about a year ago I bought a Mahindra 4035 40 HP diesel
>> tractor. I
>>>>>>>>>> starts, runs and works fine, but I've had some problems with leaks
>>>>>>>>>> lately. At the 100 hour mark Mahindra wanted me to change the
>>>>>>>>>> hydraulic
>>>>>>>>>> filter, which sits on the side of the rear housing. I talked to
>> the
>>>>>>>>>> service guy at the dealership and he said I'd lose about 2
>> gallons of
>>>>>>>>>> fluid when I did that, even with the one rear tire up on a block.
>> It
>>>>>>>>>> holds 10 gallons overall, and TSC had their premium universal
>>>>>>>>>> hydraulic/transmission fluid on sale (which states it meets or
>> exceed
>>>>>>>>>> Mahindra specs)  for $35 for 5 gallons. For me it seemed like a no
>>>>>>>>>> brainer to just dump the fluid and replace it rather that trying
>> to
>>>>>>>>>> guess how much I'd lose.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Everything went fine, I had to remove a side cover as well as the
>>>>>>>>>> filter
>>>>>>>>>> to get to a screen they wanted to have cleaned on the first
>> service
>>>>>>>>>> only. After that the tractor performed as it should but after
>> about
>>>>>>>>>> 50
>>>>>>>>>> hours I've started to develop leaks in the hydraulic system. They
>>>>>>>>>> fixed
>>>>>>>>>> one by a large square diverter valve under the tractor and today
>> they
>>>>>>>>>> are fixing another leak from the power steering block up by the
>>>>>>>>>> steering
>>>>>>>>>> wheel.  I called today and talked to the service guy and he says
>> they
>>>>>>>>>> are puzzled because the leaking o-rings they are looking at today
>>>>>>>>>> appear
>>>>>>>>>> burned, as if exposed to excessive heat. Another concern that I
>>>>>>>>>> brought
>>>>>>>>>> up to them is that the loader doesn't seem to have quite the
>> lifting
>>>>>>>>>> capacity as when it was new.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> My question is, can fluid cause these type of problems? In the
>> manual
>>>>>>>>>> they call our for Mahindra fluid, Gulf Universal Tractor
>> Transmission
>>>>>>>>>> fluid, Mobil 424, Shell Donax and a few others, all of which are
>>>>>>>>>> nearly
>>>>>>>>>> impossible to find.  Can a fluid be SO wrong that it would cause
>>>>>>>>>> problems? Right now they are looking at anything that might be
>>>>>>>>>> causing a
>>>>>>>>>> continual "deadheading" situation, but with that little 3 cylinder
>>>>>>>>>> diesel I think I would notice that.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Any and all thoughts greatly appreciated.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Mike M
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
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