[AT] Getting water out of a gearbox/now bearing life
Thomas O Mehrkam
tmehrkam at sbcglobal.net
Mon May 16 17:02:17 PDT 2016
My 2001 F250 V10 4x4 is going on 300 miles. Much of that towing a heavy
RV in the Mountains.
Original Wheel bearings. Yes they are sealed. I have stock tires.
Second set of brakes.
One U joint.
One rear Axle seal.
The only time it let me down was a fuel pump at 250,000 miles.
It is all original except for wear parts and light bulbs filters and
fluids.
On 6/5/2015 6:30 AM, charlie hill wrote:
> You know, it just occurred to me regarding what I wrote below,
> That hub assembly already has a zero speed sensor built into
> it. Surely it would not have been too hard for GM's engineers to
> put a high temperature alarm in there two. I guess it would have
> cost them a dollar or two. With the price of a new truck comparable
> to my '06 now being in excess of $50,000 you would think they could
> afford to throw it in though. Then again maybe the 2015's have that
> feature?
>
> Charlie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: charlie hill
> Sent: Friday, June 05, 2015 6:28 AM
> To: rlgoss at twc.com
> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox/now bearing life
>
> Larry, I don't see periodic replacement as a solution.
> Since you dealing with statistical failure rates isn't it
> possible that replacing the old "codger" with a new one
> might result in replacing a good old codger with a defective
> new codger? I think in a situation where bearing failure is
> critical such as where the failure would shut down a continuous
> batch polymer system or a manufacturing line my approach would be
> to monitor bearing temperature and look for trends in increasing
> temps or temperature spikes. Kind of like monitoring us old codger's
> blood pressure.
>
> Charlie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: rlgoss at twc.com
> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2015 9:17 PM
> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> Cc: charlie hill
> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox
>
> This thread brought some of my educational history to mind, and I had to do
> some searching to see if L10 is still the standard used for calculating
> bearing life. It turns out that it is. When I was first exposed to the
> process back in 1956, it was one of the most disappointing and confusing
> things I had come across. It's completely statistical in nature and gives
> no clear guidelines or "rule of thumb" material that can be followed for
> bearing life. Since all the numbers are based on a statistical time for 90%
> failure rate under specific conditions, the only way you can hope to sleep
> well at night is to adopt a schedule for component replacement that puts new
> hardware in place before the old (or original) item fails. They don't give
> us codgers awards based on our having defied the odds to make a particular
> piece of hardware last beyond its expected longevity.
>
>
> Larry
> ---- charlie hill <charliehill at embarqmail.com> wrote:
>> It's not a wheel bearing, it's an entire hub assembly complete with new
>> lug
>> studs
>> and a new zero speed sensor and wiring harness for the anti-lock brakes.
>> I don't like paying that much and there are cheaper ones out there but
>> I don't want off brand bearings on my wheels.
>>
>> Actually my experience with 90 vintage trucks is worse than new ones
>> because there were some bugs in the electronics that have now been
>> worked out. If I wanted to go old school (and I would not mind doing so
>> to
>> be honest) it would be early 80's and back, carbureted.
>>
>>
>> Charlie
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: toma at risingnet.net
>> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2015 5:39 PM
>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox
>>
>>
>> One more in a very long list of reasons not to buy a truck newer than '95.
>> --
>> Sent from myMail app for Android Thursday, 04 June 2015, 02:00PM -0700
>> from
>> Thomas Mehrkam < tmehrkam at sbcglobal.net> :
>>
>>> To my mind $180 is a lot of money for a wheel bearing. Multiply that
>>> by
>>> two and there is twice the reason to replace them before they show signs
>>> of
>>> failing.
>>> Still burns me that you cannot pack them. I am not the only one. There
>>> is
>>> a after market hub with serviceable bearings made for the Ford Super
>>> Duty.
>>> Some 4x4 nuts found that the bearings might last 30k when large tires
>>> and
>>> wheels are installed.
>>>
>>> Only $1,500 per wheel! Getting what should have been on the truck to
>>> begin
>>> with.
>>>
>>> 99-08 Ford SpynTec Parts | Spyntec Industries
>>>
>>> | |
>>> | | | | | |
>>> | 99-08 Ford SpynTec Parts | Spyntec IndustriesClick here for a parts
>>> breakdown and quantities. |
>>> | |
>>> | View on spyntec.com | Preview by Yahoo |
>>> | |
>>> | |
>>>
>>> On Thursday, June 4, 2015 3:42 PM, Doug Tallman <
>>> dtallman at accnorwalk.com > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I figured you were going by rotations The sad part is you will be lucky
>>> to get half that mileage out of the replacements. Factory ones cost
>>> about double that. Still not expensive by any means. One on my truck
>>> didn't make any noise or give any warning. it just decided to lock up.
>>> Doug T
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 6/4/2015 6:01 AM, charlie hill wrote:
>>>> Thinking back on it, my original intent was to figure out
>>>> how many times that bearing had rotated and then I decided to
>>>> convert it to cost. Obviously if I had just wanted to know how much
>>>> per mile it would have been a much simpler problem.
>>>>
>>>> Charlie
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: charlie hill
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2015 9:45 PM
>>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox
>>>>
>>>> Ah yes, I see your point now. I was working in rotations rather than
>>>> miles.
>>>> That is the history of my mathematics. I always understood the concept
>>>> but
>>>> made stupid simple mistakes. Still not a bad deal.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for the correction.
>>>>
>>>> Charlie
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Doug Tallman
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2015 7:36 PM
>>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox
>>>>
>>>> Charlie, my basic math comes out to .00112 dollars per mile. Not as
>>>> much
>>>> of a deal you thought it was. :-) Doug T
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 6/3/2015 6:31 PM, charlie hill wrote:
>>>>> hmmm after doing a little basic math it occurs to me that in 250,000
>>>>> miles
>>>>> that
>>>>> bearing has turned on the order of 150 million revolutions. At
>>>>> $280.00
>>>>> that
>>>>> works out
>>>>> to a bit less than $.000002 per mile. I don't think it owes me
>>>>> anything.
>>>>>
>>>>> Charlie
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: charlie hill
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2015 3:41 PM
>>>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox
>>>>>
>>>>> Yep the sealed bearings are a bit of a mixed blessing. No maintenance
>>>>> necessary but
>>>>> NO maintenance allowed either.
>>>>>
>>>>> I do the same thing. I recently replaced the belts on my truck. They
>>>>> weren't broken or completely
>>>>> worn out but were showing signs of wear and they were old. Did I
>>>>> throw
>>>>> them
>>>>> away...NO. They went
>>>>> behind the back seat!
>>>>>
>>>>> Charlie
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Thomas Mehrkam
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2015 2:21 PM
>>>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox
>>>>>
>>>>> One of my gripes is putting sealed bearings in the front hubs. Mine
>>>>> have
>>>>> 280,000 miles on them. Seem fine when I check them but I am sure they
>>>>> are
>>>>> running on borrowed time.
>>>>> If they were the type I could pack with grease I could check and
>>>>> repack
>>>>> then. I would likely have a spare set of packed bearings in a zip
>>>>> lock
>>>>> in
>>>>> my tool box. Just in case.
>>>>> I have a pair of prepacked bearings with every trailer I own. And
>>>>> extra
>>>>> fan
>>>>> belts in all my vehicles. Cost's nothing the fan belts are old good
>>>>> ones
>>>>> taken off to put on fresh ones.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have been saved more than once by these old spare parts.
>>>>> One Christmas holiday my daughter and I were driving the 2500 Suburban
>>>>> from
>>>>> Houston to South Padre. My wife and InLaws were at a Condo for the
>>>>> holidays. I had to work and left early in the next morning
>>>>> About Warton. 1.5 Hours I lost power steering, Power Brakes and
>>>>> alternator.
>>>>> I stopped and the belt was shredded. It seems the power steering pump
>>>>> bracket broke.
>>>>> I put on the spare belt. It would not stay on because of the bracket.
>>>>> I
>>>>> spotted a coil of barbed ware hanging on the fence next to me. Thank
>>>>> goodness for ranchers that believe on keeping old wire hanging hanging
>>>>> around for emergency fence repairs. I borrowed a short length and
>>>>> wired
>>>>> to
>>>>> pump bracket so the belt would stay on.
>>>>> I went into town and found small welding shop and asked them if they
>>>>> could
>>>>> weld it. They claimed it would not hold. The bracket was too hard.
>>>>> They
>>>>> said there was a Chevy dealer in town.
>>>>> The dealer did not have a bracket but they ran a truck to Houston
>>>>> about
>>>>> 10:30 AM every day for parts. It was about that time. He said he
>>>>> would
>>>>> order the part and have it by 3:30.
>>>>> One time the dealer did good. Got the part and got us out by 5:00 Pm.
>>>>> The
>>>>> service manager even loaned us his car so we could go to lunch.
>>>>> Made it to south padre after dark. It was late but we were able to
>>>>> salvage
>>>>> the holiday. Come to think of it all dealerships are not ripoff
>>>>> artists.
>>>>> I
>>>>> was not even disappointed with the price. This was 1996 or so.
>>>>> From: charlie hill < charliehill at embarqmail.com >
>>>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group <
>>>>> at at lists.antique-tractor.com >
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 3, 2015 10:17 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Getting water out of a gearbox
>>>>>
>>>>> I had an interesting experience this past Friday. It could have been
>>>>> bad and very expensive but it turned out well. I guess that penny I
>>>>> found
>>>>> heads up in the yard Friday morning was a good omen.
>>>>>
>>>>> I was headed to Maryland. On I-95 just south of the I-295 exit I
>>>>> started
>>>>> getting
>>>>> a bad front end vibration. I took an exit hoping to find nothing
>>>>> worse
>>>>> than
>>>>> a flat
>>>>> tire. Not so. I couldn't find a thing that looked out of place but I
>>>>> knew
>>>>> that the
>>>>> right front hub (4 WD 2006 GMC) was running on borrowed time. The
>>>>> left
>>>>> side
>>>>> was changed out about 3 years ago and the right side had over 250,000
>>>>> miles
>>>>> on it.
>>>>> I grabbed the top of the tire and snatched on it. Sure enough I felt
>>>>> about
>>>>> 1/8" or so of
>>>>> slack. There was nothing to do buy keep going. No where really to
>>>>> get
>>>>> it
>>>>> worked on.
>>>>> This was at about 3pm on Friday afternoon. I made it nearly to
>>>>> Fredericksburg Va. when
>>>>> I ran into a traffic delay for about 3 miles of stop and go. Every
>>>>> time
>>>>> I
>>>>> started I had to
>>>>> apply too much throttle and I didn't need to touch the brake pedal to
>>>>> stop!
>>>>>
>>>>> I limped to the next exit, still tied up in traffic, and got off.
>>>>> After
>>>>> pulling into a parking lot
>>>>> I searched on my phone for the nearest AutoZone. Not that I'm
>>>>> particularly
>>>>> fond of AutoZone
>>>>> but I knew a few things. There's one most everywhere, they loan tools
>>>>> and
>>>>> I
>>>>> happened to know
>>>>> that they carry that hub in the Timken brand. Sure enough there was
>>>>> an
>>>>> AutoZone store less than
>>>>> a mile from me. I found it, went in and explained my situation. They
>>>>> had
>>>>> the hub (1 in stock) and
>>>>> they had the tools and it was ok to work in their parking lot but they
>>>>> didn't have jacks or jack stands
>>>>> to loan out so I knew I'd have to buy what I needed. I asked if there
>>>>> was
>>>>> a
>>>>> local shop that could
>>>>> do it now, do it right and not rip me off. The commercial accounts
>>>>> guy
>>>>> picked up the phone and
>>>>> made a call. I heard him say Amigo, '06 Z 71 Quattro Quattro front
>>>>> hub
>>>>> NOW? The parts man
>>>>> said he can do it now. I said how much. He asked. The answer came
>>>>> back
>>>>> $100.00.
>>>>> Mind you this was at 4:15 pm on Friday. I told him yes.
>>>>>
>>>>> I bought the hub for $180.00 and they had their parts runner girl
>>>>> escort
>>>>> me
>>>>> to the shop.
>>>>> When we got there Jorge was waiting in his one bay shop in a single
>>>>> slope
>>>>> metal building
>>>>> that housed a detail shop and other similar small businesses, each
>>>>> taking
>>>>> up
>>>>> a bay or two.
>>>>> Jorge is about 50 I'm guessing. He spoke English well enough for me
>>>>> to
>>>>> talk
>>>>> to him. He apologetically
>>>>> asked if I could wait 5 minutes for him to start to let it cool. He
>>>>> offered
>>>>> us bottled water which
>>>>> we declined because we had our own. Just a few minutes later he went
>>>>> to
>>>>> work. He was fast and
>>>>> clearly knew what he was doing. I watched him work from a distance. I
>>>>> didn't want to make him
>>>>> nervous or make him think I didn't trust him but I wanted to make sure
>>>>> he
>>>>> was doing it right. He did.
>>>>> He did all the little things that some mechanics wouldn't bother with
>>>>> like
>>>>> making sure he straightened
>>>>> the slight bends he put in the dust cap that covers the axle nut when
>>>>> he
>>>>> had
>>>>> to pry it off and putting a
>>>>> bit of anti seize grease on the new lug studs.
>>>>>
>>>>> In about 45 minutes he was finished. I gave him the promised $100.00
>>>>> and
>>>>> thanked him. He gave me his
>>>>> business card just in case something wasn't right and I needed to
>>>>> call.
>>>>> (He
>>>>> knew I was passing through
>>>>> and wouldn't be back otherwise). I thanked him again and was gone.
>>>>>
>>>>> I just wish Jorge was in my town because I'd gladly use his services.
>>>>> I
>>>>> could have changed the hub myself and
>>>>> would have if I had been at home but not for $100 bucks. With my bad
>>>>> knees
>>>>> it was worth every cent of
>>>>> 100 bucks to have him do it and do it right.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes this is my tractor hauling truck (obligatory tractor reference).
>>>>>
>>>>> If you are ever in Fredericksburg VA and need a good mechanic find the
>>>>> AutoZone near the 17 Business exit (first US 17
>>>>> exit going north) and ask them to tell you how to find Jorge Auto
>>>>> Service.
>>>>>
>>>>> Charlie
>>>>>
>>>>> C
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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