[AT] OT Right of way, again

Thu Apr 2 18:36:08 PDT 2015

I think I'm beginning to understand. THANKS!
	Dave

On Apr 1, 2015, at 9:28 AM, Will Powell wrote:

> When my father and aunt owned the property they had it logged a few times, ruining the forest.... Loggers came through the road without an official right of way. 
> Ground on Tug Hill has more rocks than dirt. It really did not suffer much. 
>   
> But, it's really not a great road. I certainly can't bring my travel trailer down it. It was a WPA re-forestation parcel that is full of balsam fir. Roots all through the road. Truck only access. It's a bumpy crappy ride.  
>   
> I'm a part owner with my brother, 2 sisters, and my father. Now that I am part owner I want to do everything legally correct. I want the forester to manage the harvest, put job out for bid etc... He will not do the job without a legal right of way. Either temporary or permanent. 
>   
> The last interaction with the somewhat reclusive land owner was when my father  was brush hogging on his 8n trimming the sides of the road... That pissed the owner off and he stopped to talk with my father. My father told him we needed access to our property and we could get a right of way if we needed to. That shut the owner up and he just said use the road but don't improve the road to much.  That was about 10 years ago. The owner does not have a cabin on the parcel. His camp is about 1/4 mile away. 
>   
>  I'm sick of walking on eggshells about the road. My father does not want me to improve it because he does not want to piss the owner off. I want a legal right of way so I get the logging done right and also improve the road. 
>   
> I have not hired the lawyer. It was just a 5 minute curtesy  call where the lawyer suggested I talk the the owner first because she said owners hate it when someone leads with a lawyer over an issue. If I can't settle this on my own she would be glad to help me. 
>   
> I certainly don't want to get into a legal battle. My worst fear is that I piss him off and have him block the road.... 
>   
>   
> Regards, 
>   
> Will 
>   
>   
>   
>   
>   
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: "David Rotigel" <rotigel at me.com> 
> To: "Antique tractor email discussion group" <at at lists.antique-tractor.com> 
> Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2015 7:27:51 PM 
> Subject: Re: [AT] OT Right of way, again 
> 
> Hi Will, 
>         I’ve seen the damage that a logging road can do to a property. Are you willing to put the property back in the condition it was before the road was used for logging? When is the last time you used the road that you intend to use for logging? Many lawyers rill tell you anything you want to hear for their hourly fee. If the lawyer you are using simply tells you that you can “take it to court” she is correct. Winning the case is another thing! Also ask her what precedent she is using to tell you that you have a “good case”! Why were you told 40 years ago to not use the road? Was it the same owner at that time? 
>         I also think that if you came to me and in any way indicated that you were going to “take it to court” I would tell you “Fine, see you there. Now get the hell off my property!” My guess is that the guy could tie it up in court for years. 
>         Dave 
> PS, Having said all that I wish you good luck! And as has been said by several—BE NICE! 
> 
>> On Mar 31, 2015, at 5:41 PM, David Bruce <davidbruce at yadtel.net> wrote: 
>> 
>> I agree with Spencer you usually get further by being nice. In NC the 
>> law is any landlocked property must be provided an easement but that 
>> does require legal action if the other party is not accommodating (other 
>> states may and probably will vary). I would first have the conversation, 
>> offer some compensation if needed to get properly prepared paperwork 
>> signed. If that does not work time for court costs depending on the 
>> state laws. 
>> 
>> David 
>> NW NC 
>> 
>> On 3/31/2015 2:47 PM, Spencer Yost wrote: 
>>> Hey Will, 
>>> 
>>> Your lawyer will know all about this, but there's a thing called prescriptive easement. If you were truly landlocked, and especially if there's a long history of using the existing right-a-way, typically the court will grant you an easement. That is probably the route he/she is taking.  There are some fairly specific timetables and conditions that have to be met though. 
>>> 
>>> But, just remember to put yourself in his shoes and remember you are asking for something you probably would not even grant yourself.   Try to make an offer first.  In these circumstances I like to  remember my grandmothers adage:  Sugar is almost always a better ingredient than vinegar when trying to put something together. 
>>> 
>>> Good luck! 
>>> 
>>> Spencer 
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 31, 2015, at 13:01, Will Powell <william.neff.powell at comcast.net> wrote: 
>>>> 
>>>> Hello, 
>>>> 
>>>> I've brought this up before, I'm moving forward and would like some guidance. 
>>>> 
>>>> To review we have Land locked property in upstate NY. We've been using road through neighbors property for over 30 years.  Had a forester come in last year and we are moving toward a harvest. Forester wants a legal right of way. For about 30 years we previously used another road that went through a creek and was sometimes impassable, that road has long since grown over. The present road runs right through the center of neighbors property, it's about 80 acres? The  sides of his property are swamp and a hill, so re-routing the road on his property line would not be good. There used to be a camp on the property but that burned down about 40 years ago, when the camp was there we were asked not to use road. 
>>>> 
>>>> Talked to a lawyer and she said talk to the current owner and see if they will give us a right of way. If that does not work we have a good case to get one legally because 1) we have been using the road and 2) We need access to the property... 
>>>> 
>>>> What do I say when I call the owner? Should I offer him money? $350 to motivate him?  I don't want to telegraph the punch and say if you don't we'll see you in court. 
>>>> 
>>>> Regards, 
>>>> 
>>>> Will 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
> 
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