[AT] Fwd: Re: Help needed on non-antique tractor

Cecil R Bearden crbearden at copper.net
Tue Sep 3 19:00:03 PDT 2013


I Found IT!!!!!!!

We have been over thinking this.   I  pressurized the tank again and 
this time removed the line at the sediment bowl.   Fuel barely 
trickled.   I then built a better connection to the fuel line and blew 
back to the tank.  Some pressure built up before I heard the blockage 
break loose.   Since I need the tractor, I will remove the tank later 
and find what was causing the blockage.   If this happens again, I can 
blow out the line.   I panicked because this was my only tractor left to 
use, and it has cost a fortune to repair in the past.  I know I had 
blown out the line earlier, but I did not have a good connection to the 
line to blow out the blockage.

Thanks to everyone for the help.

Cecil in OKla




On 9/3/2013 1:21 PM, charlie hill wrote:
> That makes sense Steve.  Thanks for the explanation.
>
> As for the injector issue.  Most injector systems have return lines
> and if the injector is clogged or stuck the fuel that is supposed to go
> to the engine is over pressurizing the return line.  I don't know enough
> about it to know if it could cause a problem or not.  One would think that
> would create an engine miss.
>
> I suspect most diesel mechanics would check the injection timing and pump
> pressure  first but Cecil seems relatively sure that isn't the issue and the
> heat in the solenoid surely sounds like it could be related.
>
> Charlie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stephen Offiler
> Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 1:49 PM
> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> Subject: Re: [AT] Fwd: Re: Help needed on non-antique tractor
>
> Greetings to you, too, Charlie... it's been a while!  I just re-joined
> ATIS. (see below)
>
> A bad ground / bad connection has a higher than normal resistance, by
> definition.  High resistance has the effect of reducing current flow in the
> entire circuit.  The abnormal heat will be generated directly at that point
> of high resistance.  That's why you see connectors melt or char sometimes.
> The amount of heat generated is proportional to current squared times
> resistance.  Since the resistance is reducing the current in the whole
> circuit, the numerical value of current-squared drops quite sharply.  If
> the hypothetical bad ground / bad connection is directly within the
> solenoid, then the solenoid might get hot.  But if it is elsewhere, even a
> couple inches away, the reduced current flowing in the solenoid coil will
> result in a cooler, not hotter solenoid.
>
> On another note, I thought the input from the Cat guy was interesting.  I
> guess that is saying that an injector could fail in such a way that it is
> injecting back into the supply line?
>
> Always a learning experience...
>
>
> Best regards,
> Steve O.
>
> PS:  I recently acquired a '57 John Deere 440 crawler/dozer.  Vertical
> 2-cylinder, last in the line from M to 40 to 420 to 440 before they went to
> the 1010.  Or so I am told!  It runs real well, sat in a barn out of the
> weather for 10 years before I got it.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 1:20 PM, charlie hill
> <charliehill at embarqmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Hi Steve, I really don't know.  You are more qualified to talk about that
>> than
>> me.  I was just wondering if a bad connection would increase the
>> resistance in the circuit and cause it to heat.  Just a random thought
>> really.
>>
>> You know what Farmer used to say,  check the grounds.
>>
>> Charlie
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Stephen Offiler
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 12:23 PM
>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> Subject: Re: [AT] Fwd: Re: Help needed on non-antique tractor
>>
>> I don't think a bad ground explains the excess heat in the solenoid, does
>> it?
>>
>> SO
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 11:39 AM, charlie hill
>> <charliehill at embarqmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Cecil,  could it be as simple as a bad ground in the solenoid wiring not
>>> allowing the
>>> unit to open properly?
>>>
>>> Charlie
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Cecil R Bearden
>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 11:12 AM
>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Fwd: Re: Help needed on non-antique tractor
>>>
>>> Talked to pump shop where I got pump 3 years ago.  They said they had
>>> never had this type of problem with a fuel solenoid.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/3/2013 9:41 AM, Phil wrote:
>>>> Cecil,
>>>> Can you remove the shutdown solenoid and plug the hole? If it corrects
>>>> the problem, then you know for sure.
>>>>
>>>> Phil
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Cecil R Bearden" <crbearden at copper.net>
>>>>> To: "Antique tractor email discussion group"
>>>>> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2013 8:08 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Help needed on non-antique tractor
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> TS100 New Holland 2 WD tractor w/ 16x16 trans cab w/air loader
>>> attached.
>>>>>> Engine starts easily and seems to rev up to full throttle ok.. When
>>>>>> slightly loaded it begins to pull down and acts as if there is no
>>>>>> governor available. Tractor has 2293 hours and uses no oil. I have
>>>>>> replaced the fuel lift pump twice in last week and replaced filters.
>>>>>> It
>>>>>> has a Delphi inj pump installed at about 1550 hours. Tractor is
>>> serviced
>>>>>> and maintained regularly. When connected to 648 New Holland Baler,
>>>>>> It
>>>>>> will barely go up an incline when baling. When traveling in high
>>>>>> gear
>>> on
>>>>>> roadway, it will pull down to 1500 RPM on slight incline. Works fine
>>> for
>>>>>> about 5 minutes after starting, then begins to have no power. After
>>>>>> running about 30 minutes, I could lay my hand on the injector pump,
>>>>>> but
>>>>>> the fuel shutoff solenoid almost burned my finger.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The fuel pump on this tractor was replaced, not rebuilt with a new
>>>>>> Delphi pump 743 hours ago. I have kept the filters changed and the
>>>>>> fuel
>>>>>> clean, so I cannot believe the pump needs rebuilding unless the
>> Delphi
>>>>>> pump is a pile of crap to start with. The original pump self
>>>>>> destructed
>>>>>> at 1550 hours, requiring a new pump.   Pump shop stated the pump had
>>>>>> been tampered with causing a bolt to beak internally.  The load is
>> not
>>>>>> excessive as the tractor was pulling the same load fine 2 days
>>>>>> earlier.
>>>>>> I have sealed all possible leaks around the primary filter, and find
>>>>>> no
>>>>>> wet spots when pressurizing the tank. Is it possible that the shut
>> off
>>>>>> solenoid is bad since it is getting hot. The shutoff solenoid is a
>>>>>> plunger at the back of the pump near the distributor head. I am
>>>>>> about
>>> to
>>>>>> pull the tank and check the intake line in the tank, it is all that
>> is
>>>>>> left.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is my only tractor left with a 1000 RPM PTO that can pull my
>>>>>> swather and also has the electronic baler monitor attached...   A
>>>>>> cat
>>>>>> mechanic thought maybe an injector was pressurizing the return line
>>>>>> causing the fuel solenoid to get hot.  It does not seem to be
>> missing.
>>>>>> It seems that all these problems started after I drained the fuel
>> bowl
>>>>>> in the primary sediment bulb.  I have sealed it totally now, so
>> should
>>>>>> not be the problem.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cecil in OKla
>>>>>>
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