[AT] Never Heard Such a Bang!

Fri Mar 1 06:14:10 PST 2013

I blame a lot of our ignition problems on these cheap made Chinese 
parts.   It does not matter whose name are on them either, they are made 
in China.....
Cecil in OKla

On 3/1/2013 7:57 AM, Ken Knierim wrote:
> 2 weeks ago I fought with a buddy's Ford 3000 that had ignition issues.
> The original coil had gone south and the replacement didn't work.
>
> Here's the condensed version
>
> the original coil was an external resistor type.
> The harness did not have a resistor in it. (ran for years like this. not
> sure how)
> Original coil died. No spark output
> replacement coil was also external resistor type.
> Replacement points were installed.
> Coil wouldn't fire until new points were filed and cleaned with alcohol
> (thanks Neil Yerigan)
> Engine ran weak and rough and died again, never to restart.
> Noted resistance across points. Replaced with new Napa set.
> spark again for a short period. Looked at everything again. Replaced coil
> with internal resistor type.
> Engine started. retuned carb since it had been tweaked to run with poor
> spark.
> Very happy all around. Took me about 5 hours of cussing and getting parts
> to get it working.
> My buddy had been fighting it off and on since November.
>
> Many ignition problems are blamed on carbs. In this case we used starting
> fluid injected into the intake manifolf to make sure we had fuel that would
> ignite. After we got the first sneeze out of it, we knew we were headed in
> the right direction.
>
> We also got an el-cheapo adjustable-gap spark gap tester. This proved to be
> very handy. When the tractor lost fire we would connect the coil to the
> spark gap tester, roll the engine up to where we could move the distributor
> rotor past point opening and listen for the snap of the spark. We knew it
> was right when it was easily throwing 1/4" of spark. Early on it wouldn't
> go 1/16"... this provided an adjustable metric that helped with
> diagnostics.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Ken in AZ
>
> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 7:03 PM, John & Jan Paur <johnjanpaur2 at directcon.net
>> wrote:
>> Look for either moisture and/or cracks inside the distributer cap on the
>> magneto.  JP
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "charlie hill" <charliehill at embarqmail.com>
>> To: "Antique tractor email discussion group" <at at lists.antique-tractor.com
>> Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 7:45 AM
>> Subject: Re: [AT] Never Heard Such a Bang!
>>
>>
>>> Ben,  from my experience a problem that develops quickly and is severe is
>>> a
>>> small thing.
>>> Look for loose wires, bad grounds, etc.
>>>
>>> I once had a mag on an old Fairbanks Morse stationary engine
>>> that was dead.  The previous owner had bypassed the coil in the mag and
>>> wired an automotive coil external
>>> to it.   I have to assume they tried to find the problem before they cut
>> a
>>> hole in the Bakelite mag cap and ran
>>> that wire in it.  When I tore into it I eventually found that the mag and
>>> the old coil were fine.  The kill wire
>>> that goes to the kill lug on the side of the mag had rubbed on the mag
>>> case
>>> and was going direct to ground.
>>> I don't remember if I replaced the wire or just taped it up but the last
>>> time I started that engine a year or two ago
>>> it was still working.
>>>
>>> Look for the simple stuff and as Farmer would tell you....Check the
>>> grounds!
>>>
>>> Charlie
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Ben Wagner
>>> Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 10:13 AM
>>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group ; Farmall/IHC mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Never Heard Such a Bang!
>>>
>>> Thanks to everyone for their replies. I forgot to mention I was working
>>> with an H4 mag.   It has fire at the plug at TDC.  But I've got a loose
>>> H4 I'll try to drop in and see if that helps, just to rule out an issue.
>>>
>>> I'm nearly 100% certain that the problem is either timing/valves or
>>> spark.  After checking the valves, it's almost has to be the spark.  The
>>> problem is that the H4 hasn't had 50 hours on it since it was
>>> restored/rebuilt with a new coil, condenser, points, rotor, distributor
>>> cap, coil cover, and wires.
>>>
>>> Any other ideas, feel free to holler!  I'm planning to spend some time
>>> on it today. I'll keep everyone in the loop as to what happens.
>>>
>>> Ben W.
>>>
>>> www.oldpathsequipment.com
>>> Mt. Solon, Virginia
>>> Antique Machinery Repair and Restoration
>>>
>>> On 2/27/2013 9:38 PM, Spencer Yost wrote:
>>>> The advance in your mag/distributor is misbehaving my guess. That would
>>>> explain the bang during hand starting and fouled plugs.
>>>>
>>>> Just a theory,
>>>>
>>>> Spencer
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On Feb 27, 2013, at 21:19, Ben Wagner <supera1948 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>> It's been awhile since I've had to ask a question on here.
>> Incidentally,
>>>>> the question is on the tractor I was always bothering everyone about a
>>>>> few years ago, my 1948 Farmall Super A.  Since that restoration, I have
>>>>> completed restoring/rebuilding everything from Gravely walk behinds, to
>>>>> Clinton equipped lawn mowers, to Ford tractors, and now even John Deere
>>>>> two cylinders.
>>>>>
>>>>> All of that to say is even after all of that antique repair work, I am
>>>>> stumped on my Super A once again.  It's a long story: bear with me and
>>>>> maybe I'll give the right information that will help someone diagnose
>>>>> the problem.
>>>>>
>>>>> About a week ago, the Super A had been running for about 20 minutes.  I
>>>>> had it pushing in a John Deere M that I was rebuilding. I stopped to
>>>>> kick the block from under the Deere, while the Super A was running
>> about
>>>>> 3/4 throttle, with a snow blade, so there was load on the Touch
>>>>> Control.  I got back on the A, and gave it a little throttle to push
>> the
>>>>> Deere.  From the three seconds I had gotten off and back on the
>> Farmall,
>>>>> it suddenly had no power.  As in nearly stalling while moving in first
>>>>> gear down a slope.  I cut it off and replaced the D21 plugs with fresh.
>>>>> It ran much better, well enough to push in the Deere (which was quite a
>>>>> load) and even scurry down the road in high gear.  It was still
>>>>> sputtering slightly, but it had power.
>>>>>
>>>>> I pulled the Farmall out a day ago to (once again) move a tractor. It
>>>>> started immediately, I am hand cranking, but it had no power, once
>>>>> again.  It died while I was trying to ease it into an area where I
>> could
>>>>> work on it.   It wouldn't start back up.
>>>>>
>>>>> I tried to start it today, cold, and all I got after four hand cranks
>>>>> (choke at 1/2 like always) was one loud bang in the muffler/manifold.
>>>>> Enough to loosen the muffler from the exhaust pipe!  No backfire, but
>>>>> just one loud bang.  The engine didn't even try to start.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have checked timing.  Everything is in tip top shape.  All the valves
>>>>> are free and adjusted properly.  The carburetor is spotless: good fuel
>>>>> flow, no junk in the lines, clean jets.  It is a Zenith with no high
>>>>> speed adjustments.
>>>>>
>>>>> So the question is, what does the problem seem to be?  I have worked on
>>>>> quite a few engines (but not as many as the folks on this list) but
>> I've
>>>>> never heard such a bang without a hot engine and too much choke!
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks in advance for your help!
>>>>>
>>>>> Ben Wagner
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> www.oldpathsequipment.com
>>>>> Mt. Solon, Virginia
>>>>> Antique Machinery Repair and Restoration
>>>>>
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