[Farmall] Progress on my Int. 184 engine overhaul

[Mike Sloane]

Well, Carl, that was pretty much the kind of discussion I was referring 
to when I was describing when the issue of "to hone or not to hone, that 
is the question" came up with regard to the old C-60 engine. I did run a 
bore gauge through the cylinders first and all 4 were within .002" up 
and down, front to back, and sided to side. 
<http://public.fotki.com/mikesloane/international_184/bore-gauge.html> 
They were all VERY smooth/glazed. My thoughts ran along the lines of 
"this is an old long stroke low compression engine that will get used 
for maybe 2 hours a week during the summer grass cutting season. This 
isn't a long haul high compression diesel truck, locomotive, or skid 
steer that might run wide open around the clock for who knows how many 
hours a year". The service manual says "hone the cylinders", and, quite 
frankly, I don't think it really would matter whether I honed the 
cylinders or not in this situation. Did I hone the cylinders "properly"? 
Probably not. I used a lot of oil and a slow speed 1/2" drill, running 
the hone up and down in a constant motion and for not very long. I think 
what I did was mainly break the glaze and not take any metal off.

Mike

On 1/26/2011 7:05 AM, szabelsk at gdls.com wrote:
> With regard to honing the cylinder walls, I was always told that the main
> objective when honing the cylinder walls is to make the walls as straight
> as possible (no taper), the bores as round as possible (minimal
> distortion, which is especially important with low tension rings), to have
> the right amount of crosshatch for good oil retention and ring support,
> and to produce a surface finish that meets the requirements of the rings.
>
> Just recently I've seen several instances where honing is not required or
> recommended when rebuilding engines. Are newer blocks that much better
> than older blocks that they don't need to be honed any more? Maybe with
> newer engines the tighter tolerencing on all the piston related parts
> doesn't produce as much wear on the cylinder walls as on older blocks?????
> Don't think so.
>
> Honing is a science in itself. The type of ring that is going to be used
> determines what grit of stone should be used for the honing process. Also,
> how the stones are made affect the outcome of the polished walls. Two
> stones of the same grit can produce different finishes due to the amount
> of bonding agents and fillers used to make the stones. The type of oil
> used during the honing process also affects the outcome, as does the
> honing pressure, head speed, stroke rate and hardness of the block itself.
> The ring manufacturer has their own preferred surface requirements to
> prevent excessive ring wear, and they should be consulted to see what grit
> and type of stone should be used for honing.
>
> Then there's the fact that the stones themselves wear and should only be
> used so many times before they need to be replaced. Usually the stones
> should be replaced after every 24 cylinders worth of honing.
>
> It's surprising that most engine rebuild shops have been found not to have
> any way of checking that the walls have been done right. They just hone
> "the old fashion way" and don't have the equipment (a profilometer)
> necessary to check the finish parameters such as core roughness, average
> peak height, average valley depth, bearing areas, etc..
>
> Carl Szabelski
.