[AT] OT: Gas story

Thu Jul 5 10:17:22 PDT 2007

Well, time for my dime, Rick you are right. I retired from the Navy in 75' 
got a job with a Co (Insource Data Inc)from the windy city, funded by U of 
WI to do ground temp taking. We drilled down to 3, 5 an 7 meters to measure 
temps for 24 hours in 7 locations ( Fargo, ND, Marshall MN, Fort Dodge IA, 
Normal IL, Marion IN, Lansing MI, Marion OH, New Castle PA an Hazelton PA)

The diffance in temps was about 4 deg at 59 degs..hi 62 degs an low 56 
degs.. this was done in June of 77' and again in 82'.( paid better in 82', 
more travel money)

We found out that this data was to be used by a Thermal Eng Co in installing 
under ground heating/cooling system.

Enjoyed the work, so your data is right the temp is normally constant below 
25 feet.

Jerry NW Ohio
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rick Weaver" <Rick_Weaver at hilton.com>
To: "Antique tractor email discussion group" <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 11:15 AM
Subject: Re: [AT] OT: Gas story

> Good morning!
>
> This debate got me to try to research this question because I was under
> the impression that not too far below ground (at least just a few feet)
> that it stayed constantly 60 degrees or so.
>
> Without posting the links, I saw a couple of research sites which stated
> that the below ground temperature remained constant year over year at
> 15-20 meters.  *No site* says that worldwide the ground temperature at
> that depth is the same.  It says that it approximates the annual average
> temperature at that depth.  The further down you go (measured in
> hundreds of feet), the warmer it gets due to heat from the core.
>
> So take the average annual temperature in your area, and at 15 meters
> (more than 45 feet) the soil temperature should match.  Shallower than
> that, the daily temperature averages begin affecting the measurements.
> At 1 meter, the previous day's average temperature is approximated.
>
> I didn't expect this answer.  I always felt the cold earth wherever I
> dug a hole and it reinforced the previous belief that the 60 degree
> constant was true.
>
> Rick Weaver
>
> P.S. how this relates to gasoline in underground tanks - unless they're
> buried 45 feet below ground, the daily average temperature will affect
> the temperature of the gas stored there.  And even then, the temperature
> will match the average annual temperature.  The 60 degree constant
> isn't.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
> [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of George Willer
> Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2007 6:32 PM
> To: 'Antique tractor email discussion group'
> Subject: Re: [AT] OT: Gas story
>
> Walt,
>
> I guess it must be the different schools we went to.
>
> First, the ground temperature is NOT the same over the entire country.
> It's
> very close to the average year round air temperature of the area...
> considerably warmer in the south.  The air temperature and sunshine (and
> night time radiation) is mostly why the ground temperature is what it is
> in
> any given area.
>
> Second, the pumps meter by volume, not by weight, so when the gas is
> expanded by higher temperature there isn't as much energy in a measured
> gallon.
>
> Third, it's not really the temperature of the ground, it's the
> temperature
> of the contents of the tanker when delivering to a high volume outlet...
> the
> gas is warmed by a long trip through hot summer air and doesn't reach
> the
> temperature of the ground.
>
> Forth, Our division of weights and measures requires pumps to be
> accurate
> within 10%.  They almost never deliver more than standard.  :-(
>
> Fifth,  Sometimes things may seem like a bunch of bull if you don't
> understand them.
>
> George Willer
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com [mailto:at-
>> bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of RonMyers at wildblue.net
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2007 6:59 PM
>> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
>> Subject: Re: [AT] OT: Gas story
>>
>> George,
>> The temperature at the point where the underground tanks are stored is
> on
>> average 55 deg.  No matter what part of the country that you live in.
>> North south east or west . this is set by the government regulations.
> so
>> it really doesn't matter where you get it from.
>> In almost all states the meters on the pumps are tested to guarantee
> their
>> accuracy so this whole bunch of Bull is just that a bunch of Bull.
>> You a full gallon of gas at each station or the government will come
> down
>> hard on the owners.
>>
>> Ron
>>
>>
>> > Some folks completely miss the point.  It's the temperature of the
> gas
>> > when
>> > it's metered through the gas pump at the station that makes the
>> > difference.
>> > The gas that's expanded because it's warmer when it's measured and
> sold
>> is
>> > the point.  You're paying for slightly more than you're actually
>> getting.
>> > I
>> > doubt the difference that's claimed is as large as stated, but
> there's a
>> > difference anyway.
>> >
>> > George Willer
>> >
>> >> Subject: Re: [AT] OT: Gas story
>> >>
>> >> When you put the cold fuel in your hot tank sitting in the sun
>> alongside
>> >> the Mack doesn't it get warmer.
>> >> I can't believe that anybody would believe that the temperature of
> the
>> >> fuel would make difference. If its gasoline its preheated before it
> go
>> >> into the Carb. If its diesel it preheated in the manifold same as
> fuel
>> >> injected cars.
>> >>
>> >> Ron
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> >
>>
>>
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