[AT] OOOPS - Do as I say not as I do - now rambling off topic

Fri Jul 29 06:59:47 PDT 2005

Larry,

I'm just a country boy so I don't have first hand information, but I 
understand many large office buildings have no heating system at all.  Their 
large floor area relative to outside surface area and heavy lighting loads 
means air conditioning year around.  Is that your understanding?

George

PS, the average human body is a 428 BTUH heating system!

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Larry D. Goss" <rlgoss at evansville.net>
To: "'Antique tractor email discussion group'" 
<at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 8:40 AM
Subject: RE: [AT] OOOPS - Do as I say not as I do - now rambling off topic

> Is there a large commercial building constructed anywhere today that
> doesn't have an energy recovery drum incorporated in the air handler?
> That's a similar concept to what you're talking about, Charlie.
>
> Come to think about it, I worked in a modern building in West Virginia
> that didn't have a central air handler.  It had around 50 three-phase
> heat pumps mounted in the plenums.  One day a squirrel chewed through
> some insulation, shorted out one leg of the power, and about half of the
> motors locked up before we could get the HVAC systems shut down.  The
> telltale stench of burned varnish off the motor windings stayed in the
> building for weeks.
>
> Larry
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com
> [mailto:at-bounces at lists.antique-tractor.com] On Behalf Of charlie hill
> Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 7:03 AM
> To: Antique tractor email discussion group
> Subject: Re: [AT] OOOPS - Do as I say not as I do - now rambling off
> topic
>
> I have toyed with the idea of placing a long coil of plastic pipe in a
> coil
> about 10 feet in the ground with insulated and filtered air shafts
> coming to
> the surface from each end of the coil.  Then using some sort of air to
> air
> heat exchanger.  That is just a thought at this point.  I haven't tried
> to
> actually figure it out.
>
> I actually like oil heat.  Fuel is getting fairly pricey there is always
>
> fuel oil available in one form or another even if you have to buy diesel
>
> fuel with the road tax on it.  The new high efficiency oil furnaces (and
> gas
> too for that matter) have a very high conversion rate and some of them
> even
> to the point that they use pvc pipe for an exhaust stack.  They can be
> run
> on a small generator in the case of power outages.
>
> By the way Spencer seems to have a 15k limit on messages these days so
> we
> need to start cropping off the previous messages some.
>
> Funny thing is that I never saw the first and part of the second
> sentence of
> Roger's message until I read it in Al's reply.  Somehow it was cut out
> when
> it came to me from the list.  I figured it out but I had to read
> ..before...
> the lines.  grins.
>
> Charlie
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Al Walker" <alwalker at gvtel.com>
> To: "Antique tractor email discussion group"
> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 3:27 AM
> Subject: Re: [AT] OOOPS - Do as I say not as I do - now rambling off
> topic
>
>
>> Roger Welsch wrote:
>>
>>>Sorry, but no.  That was almost 20 years ago and I can hardly remember
>
>>>what
>>>my name was back then.  I do recall a guy down the road had one and
> built
>>>a
>>>huge pond for all the discard water.  The gallonage per hour did seem
>>>huge.
>>>His pond never got wet.  I have an old bathtub sunk at the end of the
> yard
>>>for ours and there is a small wet seep.  It's amazing how little water
> it
>>>uses.  It is about the size of a small furnace and we have a huge,
>>>3-story,
>>>seive-like, 9-room house.  We have a back-up electric coil that comes
> on
>>>if
>>>the heat exchanger can't keep up but the only time it has ever come on
> is
>>>when we turn up the thermostat beyond a point and it needs to crank
> out
>>>the
>>>heat.  I'd never do anything else now.
>>>
>>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> When we built this house two years ago, we wanted to use a ground
> source
>> heat pump. However, the system would have cost an additional $14,000.
> We
>> looked at "pump and dump" but with our below freezing winter weather,
> it
>> causes problems, not the least of which is erosion.  I don't remember
> the
>> amount now but the gallonage was quite significant, since we need a
> lot of
>> heat in winter. An option to that is to bury hundreds  of feet of
> coiled
>> plastic pipe below frost level and circulate an anti-freeze solution
>> through that. Not cheap to do either.  Elected to use off-peak
>> electrically heated radiant heat in the floor, with an LP gas
> forced-air
>> furnace as back up. Plan to add an outdoor corn burner in the future.
> We
>> added an electric central air unit to that for internal climate
> control.
>> We also have an air exchange system that uses the heat from the
> out-going
>> air to warm the incoming air to reduce total heat loss from that
> system.
>> It helps control the humidity and keeps fresh air in the house.  Oh,
> and
>> there is a gas fire place for my dearly beloved.,
>> Al in beautiful northwest Minnesota.
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