[AT] Tractor wiring/George Willer

charlie hill chill8 at cox.net
Wed Nov 17 19:00:34 PST 2004 

Hi George,  Hope you feel better soon.

Charlie
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "George Willer" <gwill at toast.net>
To: "Antique tractor email discussion group" <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 6:06 PM
Subject: Re: [AT] Tractor wiring


> Mike,
>
> I understand the feeling!  I'm currently on a lot of different medications 
> that make it difficult to type at all.  It's bothering me to see so many 
> posts that I would like to respond to but don't because of this 
> difficulty. I hope this shaky business goes away soon.  It's keeping me 
> out of the shop as well.
>
> George Willer
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Mike Sloane" <mikesloane at verizon.net>
> To: "Antique tractor email discussion group" 
> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 5:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [AT] Tractor wiring
>
>
>> You are 100% correct. What was I thinking when I wrote that? My only 
>> excuse is that I had just returned from the dentist office and was still 
>> "feeling no pain".
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> George Willer wrote:
>>
>>> Mike,
>>>
>>> Unless the rules have changed in the 53 years since my high school 
>>> physics class, the skin effect only applies to high frequencies... like 
>>> radio frequencies.  Direct current capacity depends only on the total 
>>> cross sectional area.  Naturally, stranded wire has less tendency to 
>>> work harden from vibration.
>>>
>>> George Willer
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Sloane" 
>>> <mikesloane at verizon.net>
>>> To: "Antique tractor email discussion group" 
>>> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 1:12 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [AT] Tractor wiring
>>>
>>>
>>>> One other thing: house wiring is solid copper, but for vehicles of any 
>>>> kind, you should use "stranded" copper. Also, it is my understanding 
>>>> that stranded wire will carry more current than solid wire of the same 
>>>> gauge (something called "skin effect"). The reason for using stranded 
>>>> wire is that it is better able to handle the vibrations and doesn't 
>>>> "work harden". OK, two things: resistance losses for direct current are 
>>>> higher than for alternating current, so for longer runs you need 
>>>> relatively thicker wire. Fortunately, most tractor wiring is very 
>>>> short, that that isn't usually an issue.
>>>>
>>>> Mike
>>>>
>>>> Spencer Yost wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Mattias is right, the formula holds true for any type of electrical
>>>>> circuit.   Be sure to realize resistance, an important additional load 
>>>>> on
>>>>> the circuit that may change your decision on wire size, increases with 
>>>>> the
>>>>> length of the wire.
>>>>>
>>>>> As for wire sizes, 10 ga. is used for charging circuits on virtually 
>>>>> all
>>>>> vehicles with regular duty alternators and alternators are usually the
>>>>> highest wattage circuits (400-800 watts) on a vehicle.  So I use 10 ga 
>>>>> for
>>>>> any type of charging circuit, I use 10 ga (and a relay!) for modern
>>>>> high-intensity lamps and I use 12 ga. for for lower output lights if 
>>>>> there
>>>>> is more than 2 on the circuit.  I use 14 ga. for everything else.  If 
>>>>> I am
>>>>> unsure, I use 10 ga and a separate switching circuit with a relay. 
>>>>> Heavy
>>>>> duty alternators, if I had ever wired for any, would probably get 6-8 
>>>>> ga
>>>>> wire.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have no engineering calculations to back this up but this is what I 
>>>>> have
>>>>> learned to use over the years and seems to match pretty well with what 
>>>>> is
>>>>> used in practice by manufacturers and hold up to a few offhand 
>>>>> resistance
>>>>> and wattage calculations I have done on the back of a tool package 
>>>>> label.
>>>>> I am sure others have some better ideas that maybe are tested or 
>>>>> calculated
>>>>> that may give you a better degree of comfort than "This is Spencer's 
>>>>> system
>>>>> and it works for him because nothing has burned down"  (-;
>>>>>
>>>>> Spencer Yost
>>>>> Owner, ATIS
>>>>> Plow the Net!
>>>>> http://www.atis.net
>>>>>
>>>>> *********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********
>>>>>
>>>>> On 11/16/2004 at 10:18 PM Greg Hass wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> After several years of procrastinating I am going to completely 
>>>>>> rewire my Farmall 856 with a year-a-round cab.  I can rewire a house, 
>>>>>> a barn or a shop.  However, when it comes to tractor wiring I can't 
>>>>>> figure the size of
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> wire to use when it comes to wiring the various components.  For 
>>>>>> instance,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> I want to add some halogen lights, some hooked together and some 
>>>>>> wired singly.  Also, I want to add a heater and possibly get the 
>>>>>> circulating fan
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> running, which has never worked since I've owned the tractor.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I want to use adequate sized wire, but on the other hand no bigger 
>>>>>> than needed as the heavier wire is harder to work with.  Does anyone 
>>>>>> know of a chart, or source, or rule of thumb on how to figure such 
>>>>>> things?  For instance, with house wiring "amps x volts = watts", but 
>>>>>> I'm not sure the same formula would apply to a 12-volt system.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Greg Hass
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Mike Sloane
>>>> Allamuchy NJ
>>>> mikesloane at verizon.net
>>>> Images: <www.fotki.com/mikesloane>
>>>>
>>>> The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always 
>>>> so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts. -Bertrand
>>>> Russell, philosopher, mathematician, author, Nobel laureate (1872-1970)
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>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Mike Sloane
>> Allamuchy NJ
>> mikesloane at verizon.net
>> Images: <www.fotki.com/mikesloane>
>>
>> The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so 
>> certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts. -Bertrand
>> Russell, philosopher, mathematician, author, Nobel laureate (1872-1970)
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>> AT mailing list
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>>
>
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