[AT] Allis Chalmers Model G decals

[Tim Bivens]

Phil,
Like I said I wasn't wanting to contradict you. I just
know what I know from my personal experience and have
helped put vinyl on a lot of different surfaces such
as signs, police cars, tractors etc. I just know what
works and I would never suggest to anyone like Cecil
that has never worked with vinyl to try and put it on
dry. I also hadn't thought about taking the vehicle
outside in below freezing temperatures (don't usually
have that problem here and most of the sign work is
done indoors).I hope he is going to do this in a warm
shop or wait until summer. The reason the couple
messed up their paint was just simply because they
didn't know what they were doing. They may have even
tried to scrape it off with a razorblade. I really
can't remember it was 30 years ago. What I do remember
is that the soapy water worked then and it works now.
We have even had this subject on the list before and
someone else told how to do it. Just don't use much
soap. A couple of drops in a spray bottle of water
will do it.

Tim Bivens
Glen Rose, Tex.

--- Phil Vorwerk <pvorwerk at newulmtel.net> wrote:
> Wetting agents are fine; sign shops in Minnesota do
> not like to use them if
> they are not necessary because if you do not work
> out all of the liquid VERY
> thoroughly when you take the vehicle outside in
> below freezing temps the
> vinyl can "freeze" off of the surface before it can
> become fully adhered.  I
> always tell customers that the vinyl is not fully
> adhered until it has spent
> a day outside in the hot sun.  Another thing to be
> careful with is if you
> use a lot of wetting agent the carrier sheet
> (Transferite, R Tape, etc.)
> will start to let go of the vinyl and you will end
> up with loose letters.  I
> don't like to use wetting agents, and I am very
> particular about making sure
> that logos are placed exactly, and without bubbles. 
> Using a wetting agent
> on every installation is far from a standard,
> accepted practice in the sign
> industry.
> 
> If you know of someone that pulled off some vinyl
> and messed up their paint
> job then they had an issue with their paint.  We
> regularly remove old vinyl
> lettering and install new when company's change
> names, logos, etc and need
> to make changes to their vehicles.  It is one of
> many reasons why the sign
> industry went away from painted lettering and to
> vinyl instead - when you
> sell the vehicle you can remove the lettering
> without needing to have the
> vehicle repainted.
> 
> There. Probably more than you wanted to know about
> vinyl lettering, but I've
> done more than watch someone install
> lettering........
> 
> Phil Vorwerk
> Still sunny, cool Courtland.
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Tim Bivens" <bivenshill at yahoo.com>
> To: "Antique tractor email discussion group"
> <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2004 4:24 PM
> Subject: Re: [AT] Allis Chalmers Model G decals
> 
> 
> > Cecil,
> > Whoa! Don't put those vinyl decals on yet. I am
> not
> > trying to contradict anything that Phil said and I
> do
> > not own a sign shop but I do know quite a bit
> about
> > vinyl lettering. I have been in charge of the
> > marketing for my company for the past six years
> and
> > have had a lot of vinyl signs made. We spent
> > $40,000.00 in signs last year. A very good friend
> of
> > mine works at the sign company we use. I have
> watched
> > him and helped him work on a lot of signs. He is a
> > very meticulous and professional craftsman and has
> > done vinyl for many years. Most of the work he
> does is
> > on commercial and government vehicles. He NEVER
> puts
> > vinyl on dry. What he does is that he has a spray
> > bottle of water with just a tiny bit of
> dishwashing
> > detergent in it. He sprays the surface that he is
> > putting the vinyl on and also the sticky side of
> the
> > vinyl. Then he puts it on and he can slide the
> vinyl
> > around where he wants it. Then when it is placed
> where
> > he wants it he uses a squeegee made specifically
> for
> > this purpose and squeegees the water and bubbles
> out.
> > I know it may sound strange but this works and is
> the
> > accepted way to put vinyl on in the sign industry.
> The
> > first time I ever heard of this was back in the
> > 1970's. A friend of mines parents had some vinyl
> signs
> > made for their fleet of trucks. They were going to
> > save a little money and put them on theirselves.
> Well
> > the first one they put on was all wrinkled up and
> they
> > tried to pull it off and it messed up their paint
> job.
> > They were pretty upset and they called the company
> > that had made their signs and they told them
> exactly
> > what I told you above. They tried this on the rest
> of
> > their signs and they had no more trouble. I have
> also
> > had some experience with Mylar and I will never
> buy
> > any more Mylar decals. Die-cut vinyl is the only
> way
> > to go.
> > Tim Bivens
> > Glen Rose, Tex.
> >
> > --- Phil Vorwerk <pvorwerk at newulmtel.net> wrote:
> > > Cecil -
> > >
> > > You're right about the vinyl cut lettering not
> being
> > > movable once it's down,
> > > but it isn't really much of a problem.  With
> vinyl
> > > lettering the trick is to
> > > first tape the lettering in the right location
> > > before removing the backing.
> > > Tape it along the top edge so that you can
> "hinge"
> > > it on the tape.  After
> > > getting it placed you can hinge it up, remove
> the
> > > backing, and work it down
> > > from top to bottom to help avoid bubbles.  If
> the
> > > logo is separate letters
> > > and longer than 6" inches you can make it easier
> by
> > > taping it in place, then
> > > separate the lettering into smaller sections and
> > > hinge them down
> > > individually.  If you are going onto an
> irregular
> > > surface you can use a
> > > wetting agent to give you the ability to work
> the
> > > vinyl into any dips.  A
> > > heat gun can help to get the lettering to
> conform
> > > around things that stick
> > > above the surface, such as rivets.  I hope I
> > > explained this in an
> > > understandable manner  (I've owned a sign shop
> for
> > > about 15 years, so I've
> > > done a little bit of vinyl work......)
> > >
> > > Phil Vorwerk
> > > Sunny, cool Courtland, MN
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > From: "Cecil E Monson" <cmonson at hvc.rr.com>
> > > To: "Antique tractor email discussion group"
> > > <at at lists.antique-tractor.com>
> > > Sent: Monday, March 08, 2004 10:14 AM
> > > Subject: [AT] Allis Chalmers Model G decals
> > >
> > >
> > > > I have a question as to which decals those of
> you
> > > with AC tractors
> > > > would put on a Model G being newly painted.
> What
> > > raised the question is
> > > > the fact that Maple Hunter offers decals two
> ways
> > > - vinyl cut or mylar.
> > > > Price is not a part of the question, BTW,
> although
> > > vinyl cuts are more
> > > > expensive.
> > > >
> > > > I just ordered and received a set of vinyl cut
> > > decals for my 52 Cub
> > > > and they look just fine. I have never seen the
> > > mylar decals so have no
> > > idea
> > > > which is better or if that is the case.
> > > >
> > > > The way it looks to me is that the big
> difference
> > > is the mylar decals
> > > > go on wet and can be moved after being put on
> if
> > > not exactly where they
> > > belong.
> > > > I think the vinyl cut are there to stay and
> you
> > > have one shot at getting
> 
=== message truncated ===


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com